Interesting take on Hopkins which I tend to agree with

v2k987 · Oct 19, 2011

MagnaNasakki said: ↑

The results just don't lie. He still has one of the best resumes of any active fighter, and he's long, long faded. His status as an ATG is undisputable.

That write-up above also assumes quite a bit based on personal opinion of his character. You assume he was faking cause of what you think of him. We now have X-rays showing he wasn't. Sore ass, my ass. We have one instance where we know he has out and out faked a foul for an attempted advantage, and that is the Calzaghe low-blow. He is quite overdramatic when he is fouled as a standard, but nine times out of ten, he just bitches for a second and gets back to fighting. Can count on one hand the times he hasn't.

His greatest moments lately, have had quite a bit to mar them, but every bad moment has a great win to counter it. Tito, Tarver, Pavlik, Pascal, all more or less BS free, all great wins from an older underdog.

Again, your one of the smartest posters on here, and I respect your opinion and see where it is coming from, I just find it incredibly harsh. I do wonder, however, what your take would be on Hopkins securing an immediate rematch. Would that do anything to improve your opinion. Genuine question, I don't know if it would based on what I understand of you.
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There has been no imaging to confirm the injury. No X-ray at all. An MRI result will get to Hopkins by Friday

dftaylor · Oct 19, 2011

Such an awful, obviously pro-Dawson article.

banny · Oct 19, 2011

**** B-Quit!

sabsman · Oct 19, 2011

PowerPuncher said: ↑

The write up is BS and biased, is Hopkins a bully and does he try to intimidate opponents, yes but all boxers are bullies that try to intimidate and mentally break opponents. At least they are if they have any sense about them - that's part of the game - breaking your opponent down and it's mental as much as physical. Does Hopkins cheat to get every advantage, yes he does. Many of the best in history cheat

Put on Hopkins-Vanderpool - Hopkins was outboxed and outsped much more so in the early rounds than Dawson managed to do. According to the author of this piece Hopkins would have folded like a coward instead of finding a way to adapt and win. Then there's the Taylor fights - does he fold when outboxed in the first half of the fight or turn up the heat? He does the latter. Judging a 46/41 year old as a fighter based on fights way past their physical prime is poor judgement

The author has completely misunderstood the 'I will never lose to a white boy comment' - it's more of a ghetto/black pride belief that you can't accept getting beat up by a white guy based on the centuries of oppression of blacks in America. Is it racist, yes, but it has understandable sociological roots

Trying to compare a dislocated shoulder to a broken hand or broken jaw is also seriously ******ed. When you've dislocated your shoulder you can't even raise your hand to defend yourself, you'd need to switch stances more times than Junior Witter even to avoid getting knocked out (yes I've seen Danny Williams)
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look at replay he actualy leans on his left arm to get up...

trampie · Oct 19, 2011

lefthook31 said: ↑

Bernard Hopkins (52-6-2 32 knockouts) is a boxing legend. What he has accomplished before and after the age of forty is truly amazing and warrants respect. His mental discipline and ability to endure imprisonment and not only avoid returning to jail, but to carve out a place in boxing history is something to be greatly admired. His ring IQ is at genius level and his legacy is fully secure. Now that I have gotten that out of the way, prior to his fight with Chad Dawson (31-1 18 KOs) last weekend, I held the opinion that Hopkins had the greatest post-forty career in boxing history. I no longer believe that to be true. That title reverts back to Archie Moore, who would never have done the things that Hopkins did leading up to, and including, Saturday's fight with Dawson. There have been too many incidents where Hopkins, himself a notoriously dirty fighter, has committed fouls (often when the referee isnt looking which shows calculation and premeditation) and either his opponent doesnt retaliate, or does retaliate (Roy Jones Jr. for example), only to have Hopkins overreact, exaggerate, and transform from perpetrator to victim in a heartbeat.

This quality of his has always rubbed me the wrong way and quite frankly makes me very angry. If there is one thing I cant stomach, its a bullies and cowards who are one in the same. Bernard Hopkins is simultaneously a coward and a bully. He preys on the weak (or in the case with Dawson, the perceived weak) and either succeeds in bullying and intimidating them before and during the fight, or discovers that he wont be able to succeed with these tactics and resorts to histrionics by playing the victim and looking for a clever way out.

Roy Jones accurately characterized Hopkins as a bottom feeder leading up to their rematch last year. If the coward side of Hopkins were not fraught with fear and truly believed he could avenge the 1993 defeat Jones gave him, he would have rematched Jones when Jones was at or even near his prime. Instead, Hopkins waited until Jones's blazing speed had slowed with age, and agreed to the rematch only after Jones was knocked out three times and lost five of his previous nine fights.

The bully in Hopkins appeared in his racist rant leading up to the Joe Calzaghe fight when Hopkins declared that he would never lose to a white boy. He told Calzaghe that he had feasted on soft European fighters and attempted to convince Calzaghe that he wasnt good enough or tough enough to deal with a black American/ex-convict. During the fight, he realized that Calzaghe was a pretty damn good fighter for a white boy. Hopkins was having problems keeping up with the pace, so in the tenth round what did the tough ex-con do when the going got tough? Did he bite down and fight through the fatigue like Muhammad Ali used to do? No, he found an opportunity to buy time with a horrible acting performance that only referee Joe Cortez found convincing. If you watch the replay, you will see Calzaghes punch actually banked off Hopkins' glove before literally tapping Hopkins cup. Ive boxed at the amateur level, and there is no way in hell Hopkins even felt that punch, let alone was debilitated by it!

Bullies and cowards are fraught with insecurity and the root of insecurity is fear. Fear is often used as a tool and can be very effective against others with equal or more fear, but is rendered ineffective when used against others with far less fear. People who are fraught with fear are often liars as well. If you think about it, the root of a lie is fear. People lie because they fear the consequences of telling the truth. One lie begets another. Keep all of this in mind as you think about Hopkins actions and statements before, during and after many of his fights including the one with Dawson. As I previously stated on this website, I believe that Hopkins didnt want to fight Dawson two to three years ago any more than he wanted to fight Roy Jones Jr. back in 2001 when he demanded a 50/50 purse split against Jones, who already defeated him and was by far the bigger draw.

I also dont believe Hopkins wanted to fight Dawson this time. As Stephen Breadman Edwards accurately pointed out before the fight, Hopkins had to agree to face Dawson as a condition of getting a rematch with Jean Pascal because Dawson was next in line to face Pascal for the title. Hopkins signed on to fight Dawson rather than give up the title because he believed that he now had a better chance of beating Dawson after seeing him lose Pascal, a man that he arguably defeated twice (and officially went 1-0-1 against). Hopkins believed Dawson did not have the mental strength and/or confidence to defeat Hopkins and because of that was deemed less dangerous than he compared to before Dawson lost to Pascal, when Dawson was a more confident, undefeated world champion.

After the first round in which Hopkins tried to intimidate Dawson and gain a psychological edge by bullying him against the ropes and through overall body language, I believe Hopkins realized he was in for a long night against a much younger, athletically superior fighter who had trained extremely hard and was hungry to regain his title. In the second round, Hopkins missed a right hand and ended up draped over Dawsons back after appearing to semi-leap onto it. Dawson, who wanted to show Hopkins that he was no punk and would not be bullied or rough-housed, shrugged him off and Hopkins landed on his ass, which apparently is connected to his shoulder. Did the tough ex-con gangsta Hopkins immediately rise to his feet and look to continue fighting and defeat the mentally weak, non-gangsta Dawson? No, he remained on his ass (the only thing that could possibly have been sore) and resorted to his usual attempt to con everyone into believing that he was in agonizing pain. I truly believe Hopkins thought the referee would call Dawson's action a foul and that either Dawson would be disqualified because Hopkins couldnt continue, or it would at least be ruled a no contest.

Whether the referee made a mistake or not by ruling it a non-foul, and therefore a technical knockout win for Dawson, is not the point. The point is that Hopkins was mindful of all of this and did what cowards do: he looked for a way out. There is now a report released by Hopkins stating that Hopkins suffered a separation of his shoulder and collarbone. Hopkins is claiming that he pleaded with the referee to be able to continue fighting and that he claimed he could continue fighting with one arm. I find all of that extremely difficult to believe considering Hopkins disposition and personality. If Hopkins was in that much pain with his adrenaline pumping during the fight, why was he able to conduct an interview with no sign of being in pain and simply having an ice pack applied to his shoulder?

Lets assume that the injury was legitimate. Why didn't he try to fight through it? Arturo Gatti suffered a fractured hand in his third fight with Mickey Ward, and not only fought ten rounds, but punched with the broken hand! Muhammad Ali suffered a broken jaw against Ken Norton and fought almost all of the fifteen rounds in agonizing pain. A shot Mike Tyson, who few have accused of being a mentally tough fighter, suffered a torn meniscus against Danny Williams and continued fighting through the pain and didnt even tell his trainer in between rounds about it. Yuri Foreman fought Miguel Cotto for a round with an injured leg that later required surgery. Evander Holyfield had part of his ear bitten off by Mike Tyson and rather than use that as an excuse to quit the way Hopkins would have, told his trainer to put his mouthpiece back Im gonna knock him out! Arthur Abraham defearted Edison Miranda with a broken jaw. Thats how gangstas behave.

The legendary late great Cus DAmato famously said the following: the hero and the coward both feel the same thing, but the hero uses his fear, projects it onto his opponent, while the coward runs. It's the same thing, fear, but it's what you do with it that matters." Cus died before Bernard turned pro, but Im pretty sure if he lived long enough to have seen him fight he would not have characterized him as a hero. Hopkins deserves the same amount of credit that all professional fighters deserve for stepping into the ring. Boxing is a very dangerous sport as we all know. Relative to the aforementioned fighters, however, he is far from a hero, very far from a gangsta, and very much a coward.
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Great article.

trampie · Oct 19, 2011

lefthook31 said: ↑

Weve seen the same character come out Bernard when he was in his prime. Look realistically at his toughest fights and moments in boxing and many of them are tarnished with BS. For a guy who has been a career fouler, he overeacts and fakes when the tables are turned on him. Ive felt Hopkins has been overated for years, Saturday was just more proof.
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True

trampie · Oct 19, 2011

lefthook31 said: ↑

I dont dispute the guys an ATG, but I think his status in the context of ATG's is overated.
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True

trampie · Oct 19, 2011

Beouche said: ↑

Good read. Hopkins does himself no favours. Everytime he takes a big step forward, he then seems to take an equally big step back. He's a dirty cheat, a coward and a bully. He's also an ATG, but that shouldnt blind people to his flaws
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True

trampie · Oct 19, 2011

Morrissey said: ↑

Hopkin's resume is very solid and he is well-entrenched in the ATG ranking, but I think he should not get a pass for his Calzaghe defeat.

The master boxer was made to look like a helpless bullied kid. Prime for prime, I feel Calzaghe has his number.
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Calzaghe would beat Hopkins at any stage of their careers, Calzaghe was near retirement and borderline shot when they fought, Hopkins had his best wins of his career either side of losing to Joe Calzaghe.

Dynamite · Oct 19, 2011

in any fight hopkins feels threatened he will start to foul his opponent hoping the other guy retaliates blatantly in order to cause a point being deducted by the blatant fouler.. hopkins looks at this as being smart boxing thats within the rules which it is but.. at any moment hopkins feels he has been blatantly fouled due to his bull**** antics like driving his head forward then complaining bout being hit behind the head or laying on his opponents back after rushing in after a right hand due to the fear of being countered or just hoping that his opponent causes a foul that results in hopkins being thrown off, instinctively causing hopkins to hit the deck complaining off an injured shoulder thats unable to continue usually resulting in a DQ.. hopkins calls this experience i call this bull****.. hopkins will always be credited with a good career but the way he wins will always be questioned by his bull**** antics. a man that robs u at gunpoint is the same as a man that robs u by PPV only difference is he is wearing a gimp mask this time

iceman71 · Oct 19, 2011

lefthook31 said: ↑

Bernard Hopkins (52-6-2 32 knockouts) is a boxing legend. What he has accomplished before and after the age of forty is truly amazing and warrants respect. His mental discipline and ability to endure imprisonment and not only avoid returning to jail, but to carve out a place in boxing history is something to be greatly admired. His ring IQ is at genius level and his legacy is fully secure. Now that I have gotten that out of the way, prior to his fight with Chad Dawson (31-1 18 KOs) last weekend, I held the opinion that Hopkins had the greatest post-forty career in boxing history. I no longer believe that to be true. That title reverts back to Archie Moore, who would never have done the things that Hopkins did leading up to, and including, Saturday's fight with Dawson. There have been too many incidents where Hopkins, himself a notoriously dirty fighter, has committed fouls (often when the referee isnt looking which shows calculation and premeditation) and either his opponent doesnt retaliate, or does retaliate (Roy Jones Jr. for example), only to have Hopkins overreact, exaggerate, and transform from perpetrator to victim in a heartbeat.

This quality of his has always rubbed me the wrong way and quite frankly makes me very angry. If there is one thing I cant stomach, its a bullies and cowards who are one in the same. Bernard Hopkins is simultaneously a coward and a bully. He preys on the weak (or in the case with Dawson, the perceived weak) and either succeeds in bullying and intimidating them before and during the fight, or discovers that he wont be able to succeed with these tactics and resorts to histrionics by playing the victim and looking for a clever way out.

Roy Jones accurately characterized Hopkins as a bottom feeder leading up to their rematch last year. If the coward side of Hopkins were not fraught with fear and truly believed he could avenge the 1993 defeat Jones gave him, he would have rematched Jones when Jones was at or even near his prime. Instead, Hopkins waited until Jones's blazing speed had slowed with age, and agreed to the rematch only after Jones was knocked out three times and lost five of his previous nine fights.

The bully in Hopkins appeared in his racist rant leading up to the Joe Calzaghe fight when Hopkins declared that he would never lose to a white boy. He told Calzaghe that he had feasted on soft European fighters and attempted to convince Calzaghe that he wasnt good enough or tough enough to deal with a black American/ex-convict. During the fight, he realized that Calzaghe was a pretty damn good fighter for a white boy. Hopkins was having problems keeping up with the pace, so in the tenth round what did the tough ex-con do when the going got tough? Did he bite down and fight through the fatigue like Muhammad Ali used to do? No, he found an opportunity to buy time with a horrible acting performance that only referee Joe Cortez found convincing. If you watch the replay, you will see Calzaghes punch actually banked off Hopkins' glove before literally tapping Hopkins cup. Ive boxed at the amateur level, and there is no way in hell Hopkins even felt that punch, let alone was debilitated by it!

Bullies and cowards are fraught with insecurity and the root of insecurity is fear. Fear is often used as a tool and can be very effective against others with equal or more fear, but is rendered ineffective when used against others with far less fear. People who are fraught with fear are often liars as well. If you think about it, the root of a lie is fear. People lie because they fear the consequences of telling the truth. One lie begets another. Keep all of this in mind as you think about Hopkins actions and statements before, during and after many of his fights including the one with Dawson. As I previously stated on this website, I believe that Hopkins didnt want to fight Dawson two to three years ago any more than he wanted to fight Roy Jones Jr. back in 2001 when he demanded a 50/50 purse split against Jones, who already defeated him and was by far the bigger draw.

I also dont believe Hopkins wanted to fight Dawson this time. As Stephen Breadman Edwards accurately pointed out before the fight, Hopkins had to agree to face Dawson as a condition of getting a rematch with Jean Pascal because Dawson was next in line to face Pascal for the title. Hopkins signed on to fight Dawson rather than give up the title because he believed that he now had a better chance of beating Dawson after seeing him lose Pascal, a man that he arguably defeated twice (and officially went 1-0-1 against). Hopkins believed Dawson did not have the mental strength and/or confidence to defeat Hopkins and because of that was deemed less dangerous than he compared to before Dawson lost to Pascal, when Dawson was a more confident, undefeated world champion.

After the first round in which Hopkins tried to intimidate Dawson and gain a psychological edge by bullying him against the ropes and through overall body language, I believe Hopkins realized he was in for a long night against a much younger, athletically superior fighter who had trained extremely hard and was hungry to regain his title. In the second round, Hopkins missed a right hand and ended up draped over Dawsons back after appearing to semi-leap onto it. Dawson, who wanted to show Hopkins that he was no punk and would not be bullied or rough-housed, shrugged him off and Hopkins landed on his ass, which apparently is connected to his shoulder. Did the tough ex-con gangsta Hopkins immediately rise to his feet and look to continue fighting and defeat the mentally weak, non-gangsta Dawson? No, he remained on his ass (the only thing that could possibly have been sore) and resorted to his usual attempt to con everyone into believing that he was in agonizing pain. I truly believe Hopkins thought the referee would call Dawson's action a foul and that either Dawson would be disqualified because Hopkins couldnt continue, or it would at least be ruled a no contest.

Whether the referee made a mistake or not by ruling it a non-foul, and therefore a technical knockout win for Dawson, is not the point. The point is that Hopkins was mindful of all of this and did what cowards do: he looked for a way out. There is now a report released by Hopkins stating that Hopkins suffered a separation of his shoulder and collarbone. Hopkins is claiming that he pleaded with the referee to be able to continue fighting and that he claimed he could continue fighting with one arm. I find all of that extremely difficult to believe considering Hopkins disposition and personality. If Hopkins was in that much pain with his adrenaline pumping during the fight, why was he able to conduct an interview with no sign of being in pain and simply having an ice pack applied to his shoulder?

Lets assume that the injury was legitimate. Why didn't he try to fight through it? Arturo Gatti suffered a fractured hand in his third fight with Mickey Ward, and not only fought ten rounds, but punched with the broken hand! Muhammad Ali suffered a broken jaw against Ken Norton and fought almost all of the fifteen rounds in agonizing pain. A shot Mike Tyson, who few have accused of being a mentally tough fighter, suffered a torn meniscus against Danny Williams and continued fighting through the pain and didnt even tell his trainer in between rounds about it. Yuri Foreman fought Miguel Cotto for a round with an injured leg that later required surgery. Evander Holyfield had part of his ear bitten off by Mike Tyson and rather than use that as an excuse to quit the way Hopkins would have, told his trainer to put his mouthpiece back Im gonna knock him out! Arthur Abraham defearted Edison Miranda with a broken jaw. Thats how gangstas behave.

The legendary late great Cus DAmato famously said the following: the hero and the coward both feel the same thing, but the hero uses his fear, projects it onto his opponent, while the coward runs. It's the same thing, fear, but it's what you do with it that matters." Cus died before Bernard turned pro, but Im pretty sure if he lived long enough to have seen him fight he would not have characterized him as a hero. Hopkins deserves the same amount of credit that all professional fighters deserve for stepping into the ring. Boxing is a very dangerous sport as we all know. Relative to the aforementioned fighters, however, he is far from a hero, very far from a gangsta, and very much a coward.
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i watched this "slam" about 15 times sober...first night i had a buzz. i cant see any other way he could have landed any softer...and HBO team was looking for any reason to justify by saying "look look he fell on his elbow" with Hopkins grimacing all the way until the locker room.
i dont know whats worse
1) how easy he fell and landed
2) how he could possibly be hurt from this

chad was right...cant have it both ways..you want to be all gangster and old school...but went out like that....almost comical the more i watch

BoxingFanNo1 · Oct 19, 2011

Doesn't happen often but I agree with everything you've said Lefthook31.

KO-KING · Oct 19, 2011

The Following is the Law in Calfornia athletic commision.

Under the rules in California when a bout ends for a reason other than a punch within four rounds it should result in a No-Decision (or No-Contest) , Pat Russell (referee) can not award a TKO by the rules of the California State Athletic Commission, The injury (believe it or not), was not due to a punch - Since the injury was caused by a push or a slam whatever you want to call it and not a punch; the decision that was awarded was wrong as it should have been ruled a No-Contest.

NO CONTEST.

Disagree if you don't Know **** about Boxing

iceman71 · Oct 19, 2011

KO-KING said: ↑

The Following is the Law in Calfornia athletic commision.

Under the rules in California when a bout ends for a reason other than a punch within four rounds it should result in a No-Decision (or No-Contest) , Pat Russell (referee) can not award a TKO by the rules of the California State Athletic Commission, The injury (believe it or not), was not due to a punch - Since the injury was caused by a push or a slam whatever you want to call it and not a punch; the decision that was awarded was wrong as it should have been ruled a No-Contest.

NO CONTEST.

Disagree if you don't Know **** about Boxing
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so how does gabriel ruelas lose by tko when jeff franklin accidentally snapped his arm throwing a punch? i would guess that it happened in the 7th round rather before was a factor?

Quincy K · Oct 19, 2011

at the time, hopkins would have been giving up 15 pounds to jones jr. why should b-hop give an unfair edge to dawson and engage the remainder of the fight with a handicap against someone who obviously commited a foul?

i had dawson in the fight and agree that b-hop would probably lost this fight and will lose the rematch, which will probably not happen for the reasons that you have explained.

my guess is that b-hop retires such as sweet pea did after sufffering the same type of injury.

if he doesn't, i believe that from here on out he is a great fade against most contenders in the 168-175 pound division.

props for dawson for having winky in his camp and corner.

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Interesting take on Hopkins which I tend to agree with

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Interesting take on Hopkins which I tend to agree with

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