Johnson V Langford in 1909 ?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by mcvey, Apr 14, 2011.


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  1. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    There is no one on Langford's 1909 sheet that Johnson would not be expected to beat comfortably.

    Schreck tko1rd . He was way out of shape.

    Hague ko4rds . He was a crude brawler who knocked Langford down .

    Dixie Kid rtd5rd . He was a welterweight .

    Kubiak w6 He lost to Kaufmann.Harris, Ferguson . Johnson victims, drew with Ross another victim, and was 3 times beaten by Kid Cotton, Johnson's sparring partner

    Barry d 10rds and w 6rds .He drew twice with Flynn, a 2x ko victim of Johnson's ,and was kod by Kaufmann whom Johnson comprehensively outclassed.

    Lille ? ko2rds. I think we might expect Johnson to beat him.

    Ferguson draw 12 rds. Johnson beat him 5 out of 5 in fights that Ferguson was easily beaten in.

    Klondike ko 2rds and a dec . Johnson had kod him 9 years earlier.

    Harris ko2 . Johnson had kod him in 1 rd.

    In 1909 Johnson beats Langford, by clear decision.
     
    mcvey, Nov 3, 2011
    mcvey, Nov 3, 2011
    #61
  2. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    wtf

    True, but as the multiple primary sources you have failed to acknowledge show, Johnson was out of shape for this fight.

    Wtf?!
     
    McGrain, Nov 3, 2011
    McGrain, Nov 3, 2011
    #62
  3. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    Mendoza doesn't " do primary sources".

    They are irrelevant,inconvenient, and incontestable.
    So best left ignored.:lol:
     
    mcvey, Nov 3, 2011
    mcvey, Nov 3, 2011
    #63
  4. he grant

    he grant Historian/Film Maker

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    If you are going to consider Johnson in any match up you must carefully factor the time in his career .. in 09 he was already showing the first signs of defiant behavior and self-destructive behavior ... the O'Brien fight is a perfect example ... his excessive drinking had begun .. the title he fought so hard to win was really not cherished in the light hit should have been ... JOhnson faced a unique series of challenges outside of the ring as champion and it took it's toll on him as time progressed .. it heavily influenced his inside the ring performances ....
     
    he grant, Nov 3, 2011
    he grant, Nov 3, 2011
    #64
  5. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    1.This was a sparring session, you cannot have a decison in a sparring session ,otherwise one might say, [and no doubt you would if it were Johnson]. Marciano was tko'd by Toxie Hall.:patsch
    2. So you say Johnson did not have great defence?
    I think you are on your own there, and against EVERY SINGLE EXPERT who was ever polled on the subject, no doubt they are wrong and ,you are right in your own mind at least ,[ well ,in what passes for a mind ].:lol:

    3. The authenticity of the knockdown of Johnson is highly debatable.
    The end result is not. Ketchel out , spead eagled,on the floor as though shot through the brain.

    Johnson had been partying the night before he fought O Brien
    Does a fit ,focused ,Johnson , draw with O Brien?
    Johnson hammered both Burns and Ketchel, O Brien conquerors.



    Now ,why did I bother conversing with an idiot?:huh
     
    mcvey, Nov 3, 2011
    mcvey, Nov 3, 2011
    #65
  6. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    O'Brien-Johnson almost certainly wasn't for the title.
     
    McGrain, Nov 3, 2011
    McGrain, Nov 3, 2011
    #66
  7. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    It probably was for the title on paper, but it would be like a prime Evander Holyfield having a short title fight against Maxier Rosenbloom, where Rosenbloom could only win by scoring a knockout in a short fight.
     
    janitor, Nov 3, 2011
    janitor, Nov 3, 2011
    #67
  8. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Which papers?
     
    McGrain, Nov 3, 2011
    McGrain, Nov 3, 2011
    #68
  9. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

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    McGrain,


    Please show me on which film where Ketchel resembles anything close to a boxer.


    You know a O'Brien boxed Johnson to a stand still, and made him look very bad.


    You also know what Gunboat did in the ring with Johnson. Call it a 4 round expiation match, or whatever you wish, the punch, and Johnson reaction to it were real. How the heck is Johnson going to take Langford's power?
     
    Mendoza, Nov 3, 2011
    Mendoza, Nov 3, 2011
    #69
  10. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

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    I post plenty of them. You choose to ignore:lol:
     
    Mendoza, Nov 3, 2011
    Mendoza, Nov 3, 2011
    #70
  11. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    Now this is a good analogy .:good
     
    mcvey, Nov 4, 2011
    mcvey, Nov 4, 2011
    #71
  12. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    How about those concerning Burns having Jaundice and asking for a postponement?
    That's two you've consistently ignored requests for.
    Now how about one that states Johnson said unprintable things about black women?
    That will be three to be going on with.

    POST ANY PRIMARY SOURCES THAT CONTRADICT ME, AND I WILL ADDRESS THEM .FAIR?
     
    mcvey, Nov 4, 2011
    mcvey, Nov 4, 2011
    #72
  13. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

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    I posted a book on Burns that clearly states those at ringside said he looked yellow and sick. I also posted something similar from Cap Roberts. You have a very selective memory, and one that really doesn't last very long.



    Johnson did call black women two timing whores. It matters not which newspaper report, or book I post here. If it has inconvenient truths on Jack Johnson you will ignore it.:deal
     
    Mendoza, Nov 4, 2011
    Mendoza, Nov 4, 2011
    #73
  14. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    You posted NO PRIMARY SOURCES , you posted a book that was an object of ridicule. I without any effort, found 14 mistakes in the three pages you posted.
    Larry Roberts is allmost as big a twat as you are, he gave NO PRIMARY SOURCES AND LIKE ,THE OTHER IDIOT MADE MANY ERRORS.

    I have the memory of an elephant.
    I can recall lies you posted 2 years ago ,and I will never forget them.
    YOU STATED ON THIS FORUM.
    " Burns had a jaundice".
    "Burns asked for a postponement " .
    Despite countless requests for evidence to substantiate these claims you have produced NONE.
    Now add to these your claim that Johnson made distasteful remarks about black women. AGAIN NO PROOF despite requests for it.
    I've given you an opportunity to contradict me and prove me wrong, post the primary sources
    .Otherwise, we have to conclude there are none, and you are being a "Mendacious Mendoza, " yet again.:nono
     
    mcvey, Nov 4, 2011
    mcvey, Nov 4, 2011
    #74
  15. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    You have excelled yourself.:good:lol:
     
    mcvey, Nov 4, 2011
    mcvey, Nov 4, 2011
    #75
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