Johnson V Langford in 1909 ?

I honestly did not understand your position and still not sure if I agree ...

 

As is well documented!

 

Perhaps you did not read where I wrote "did" not ..

 

I do think that the fight was more competitive than generaly given credit for.

 

The groundhog is back I see. Please tell me then, why would langford have better than a 15% chance to beat Johnson?

 

In 1909 johnson is a rightful favourite over any heavyweight of his era, in fact he beat them all at some point anyway.

After jeffries is when johnson begins to lose motivation and when langford has more of a chance. By 1913 I make sam a solid favourite.

Seriously, anyone FAVOURING sam here would struggle to put up a valid explanation imo.

I've not read through the thread and there's a chance I commented on it in previous months but based on what I now know, making anyone, from that time, a favourite over johnson in 1909 is a bit strange based on evidence.

 

Looking at the local reports, a picture emerges that is subtley different to the perceived wisdom.

Langford might have stung Johnson a couple of times, and forced him to fight negativley in places.

It makes his subsequent reluctance to fight Langford more understandable.

 

Johnson was considerd second only to Jeffries in 1909, and his win over Jeffries left him as the undisputed #1.

After that, Langford was rated second only to Johnson.

The crucial factor as you say, is that Johnson declines rapidly, more than the public know, after the Jeffries fight.

 

Yes and I really see no validity in believing jeffries would have been any more successful in 1909. I know lineage people might still see james as the champ and i'm sure some boxing figures still recognised james as the champ, but knowing what we know now, it's fair to say noone would have beaten jack that year.

Yeah the layoff didn't help, nor did the immediate interest in seeing the boxing phenom box; he was able to make money against unworthy challengers. On one hand, he'd proven himself already as the king of his era, on the other, another 5 years beating langford, jeannette, mcvey, wills and smith certainly wouldn't hurt.