Just watched the Pac-JMM fight for the 1st time !

i think if we averaged all FAIRLY knowledgeable posters scores it would average at 116-112 more than any over score, 4 rounds is a whole third of a fight, of course it was a robbery!

 

You sayin' I ain't knowledgeable, Hook?! **** you, brah! :twisted:

 

...you said you had it for Marquez! :huh

 

no i am not, you are one of the most knowledgeable posters here, far more so than me.

how did you score it?

i said most would be 116-112 maybe some 115-113 and some 117-111

 

There was nothing crystal clear about giving eight rounds to Marquez, IB.

I'm usually close to your scores, but IMHO, you were right out to lunch with this one.

I scored it 7-5 for Pac and gave Marquez rounds you didn't give him.

Of the last four, he only won the eleventh on my card.

He just wasn't busy enough to win the rounds. You have to realize that different folks judge different aspects of scoring differently, and what you term FACTS, are sometimes opinions.

Also, in defence of Butcher, you don't need to score a fight RBR to conclude there was no robbery.

If I watch a fight where all or most of the rounds are very close (even four close rounds !), then I can conclude that either guy could pick up the decision, based on the swing rounds,. Hence, I might concludd that the fight could go either way. Hence. no robbery.


Props for the RBR. Though I was too into the fight last night to partake, I usually enjoy the thread.


And usually agree with your scoring.:yep

 

For anyone to say the fight was not a clear win for Marquez have to name 6 rounds he surely lost. What round did you say, "clear pac round". Pac never ever took control of the fight at any point. He won the 10th rd just charging jmm out of desperation looking for the KO shot. JMM played it safe and refused to get drawn in a fight and won the very next rd. How many times was Marquez head snapped back? We all know Pac can punch and guys react to his clean shots. JMM was buzzed maybe once or twice but we seen pac do his glove clap over and over after receiving a two piece.

 

perfect

 

Just a correction IB, most people had Pacquiao winning the 1st, not Marquez :good

 

Not one person who was online last night and posting in the RBR thread said so.

I saw about a dozen "10-9 Marquez" posts (and again, none saying they had it for Pac except for me) and several people directly called me out and attacked me for scoring the first round for Pac and for having him up 39-37 through 4.

Then, people were attacking me for scoring the late rounds (like the twelfth) to Marquez.

I just can't win. You can't please all the people all the time, and if you're me you can't please ANYBODY any of the time.

Good thing my scores are entirely unencumbered by such worries owing to my not giving a **** what anyone thinks. :thumbsup

 

What fight did you watch?

JMM was the aggressor many, many times. He was constantly lunging forward & landing the first punch. Anyone who claims Pac was the aggressor in that fight simply proves they know nothing about boxing.

 

Pacquiao could definitely have won six rounds. Seven MIGHT be possible. Eight is taking it too far. Marquez, on the other hand, could have won as many as nine rounds in my view. Some close rounds in there.

I only gave Pac five but is not that presumptous as to give that much credence to my own eyes. Judging a fight is subjective to a degree - no matter what some people are implying.

The mere fact that the posters who had JMM winning differed in which rounds they gave him tells me that it wasn't a robbery.

JMM had some very good middle rounds in which he was soundly taming and outboxing Pac, but seven or even eight rounds of the fight was quite close. Pac has an argument for three or even four of the first six (not a lot happened here) and three of the last six (Pac was finally connecting solidly and putting it on a bit the last rounds).

I´ll get back tomorrow after rewatching the fight. It was certainly controversial, though. JMM, as a whole, did much better in the rounds he won.

He also surprised a lot of people by being so sharp whereas Pac dissapointed big time. Predictable headhunting, always a double jab before the left and to top it off bouncing on his toes to really telegraph his attack. Add to that very limited body work, same feints everytime, dangerous overcommitting and no guard for uppercuts we have good reason to be dissapointed in a man who has spoiled us the last years.

The biggest reason though is his remarkable loss of speed and legs. It started in the Mosley fight already. Looks too big and bulked up a bit stiff in the legs. The in-and-out movement has come to shambles a bit. There were some moments where JMM a bit sluggishly, too, overcommited. I expected Pac to take advantage of those mistakes with his feet like he did in the second fight at some points. He didn't.

All this - the underdog performing much better and the favorite dissapointing - can have a big effect om post-fight scorecards. Add to that a forum that heavily influences people, post-fight hysteria and fanboys all over the place it all gets rather heated. Just look at the constructive thread Bogotazo created where nobody actually bothered to read and argue with the post - instead they just put up horrible one-liners and made insults.

JMM is a true master though as his style definitely contríbuted to Pac's relative one-dimensionalness. It's shame that he can't get a win on paper. In my, perhaps pro-JMM, eyes - he won all three. The first two were razor-close. This was a bit better for JMM.

Still not a pure robbery in my eyes.

 

Oh well, that's what happens when your like one of the top figures of the forum :bbb

 

this is flawed. You only have to point out 6 close rounds and give all of them to Pacquiao.

It may be improbable from a coin toss perspective to give all close rounds to one fighter, but this is often what happens for a variety of reasons (read: in this case, economic ones).

 

For Manny to of won you would have to be giving him the benefit of the doubt majority of the close rounds, and be giving Marquez none. That right there tells it own story about who shoulda won.

 

...what six rounds were close?