What are you thoughts on the nws era?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by lufcrazy, Nov 30, 2011.


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  1. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    I'm not talking the obvious sparring sessions or non fight attempts, but the actually fights people had with no decision rendered.

    Should they count on a fighter's record and should they be considered when discussion a fighter's resume?
     
    lufcrazy, Nov 30, 2011
    lufcrazy, Nov 30, 2011
    #1
  2. Mr Butt

    Mr Butt Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    they are rightly on a fighters career record but i am not sure about the effect they have on a fighters resume it may depend on whether there are any newspaper articles on the fights
     
    Mr Butt, Nov 30, 2011
    Mr Butt, Nov 30, 2011
    #2
  3. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    Say, for instance, greb's nws victories over the lhw's of his era.

    I count them as equally as his official fights.

    The only time I don't is when the fight was clearly thrown or sparred.
     
    lufcrazy, Nov 30, 2011
    lufcrazy, Nov 30, 2011
    #3
  4. Senya13

    Senya13 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Sometimes even having a newspaper report on the fight is not enough, as is the case, for example, with Freddie Welsh. One has to read more on him to understand he just didn't give a damn to newspaper decisions most of the time and went there to last the distance and grab the money. When he actually fought on the level, such as in the rematch with Benny Leonard, he showed what a wonderful fighter he was.
     
    Senya13, Nov 30, 2011
    Senya13, Nov 30, 2011
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  5. Mr Butt

    Mr Butt Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    not saying he was a journeyman but today that attitude would have him described as one . and if he chose to not fight on the level then he must be marked down for that i would think
     
    Mr Butt, Dec 1, 2011
    Mr Butt, Dec 1, 2011
    #5
  6. Flea Man

    Flea Man มวยสากล Full Member

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    Of course they should, just takes more research to see who (probably) got the better of it.
     
    Flea Man, Dec 1, 2011
    Flea Man, Dec 1, 2011
    #6
  7. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    Exactly my attitude that. If a fighter chooses to underperform it's his own fault imo.
     
    lufcrazy, Dec 1, 2011
    lufcrazy, Dec 1, 2011
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  8. Senya13

    Senya13 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    People are pretty lazy creatures and they adjust to the conditions they live/work in. You can't really appraise his class if you ignore that.
     
    Senya13, Dec 1, 2011
    Senya13, Dec 1, 2011
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  9. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    En contraire I think you can appraise it for just that reason.

    A man who could really turn it on on his day but was largely inconsistent and unmotivated.

    Dare I say that sounds similar to buster douglas and oliver mccall?
     
    lufcrazy, Dec 1, 2011
    lufcrazy, Dec 1, 2011
    #9
  10. Senya13

    Senya13 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Not really. His defense was always top notch, whether motivated or not. It's only his offense that he rarely showed, but when he did, he proved it was top notch as well.
     
    Senya13, Dec 1, 2011
    Senya13, Dec 1, 2011
    #10
  11. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    More like a james toney then?

    Either way I think nws fights do mean something and mean just as much as official fights.

    Does my head in seeing champions losing 6 nws fights a year where they got battered but not stopped so kept their belt. It's ridiculous.
     
    lufcrazy, Dec 1, 2011
    lufcrazy, Dec 1, 2011
    #11
  12. Surf-Bat

    Surf-Bat Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Try and look at it like Roberto Duran losing to Esteban DeJesus in that non-title fight when RD was champion.
     
    Surf-Bat, Dec 1, 2011
    Surf-Bat, Dec 1, 2011
    #12
  13. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    That was fought at light welter though with de jesus weighing in at 138. That's closer to lww than lw.

    For me that doesn't indicate anything about his championship status at lw.
     
    lufcrazy, Dec 1, 2011
    lufcrazy, Dec 1, 2011
    #13
  14. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    From my perspective this is how I see it now.

    If your a champion and you lose a nws fight that has a decent writeup and recorded weights that are around your divisional limit, your claim is ****.

    A bog standard 6 round nws win/loss with no writeup and no recorded weights is very hard to fathom anything about so for championship purposes I'd just consider it as what it is at face value; a no decision fight. Practically treating it like a draw.

    I do appreciate the effort boxrec have put into tracing down news decision results and by and large I'll take their word when they say "4 nws voted for boxer a, 1 nws voted for boxer b so a gets the nws decision" that's perfectly fine.

    It's the smaller fights with no reports I'm dubious about. If just one newspaper was covering it, giving no write up then I'm not too sure what to make of it.
     
    lufcrazy, Dec 2, 2011
    lufcrazy, Dec 2, 2011
    #14
  15. SLAKKA

    SLAKKA Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Looking into Grebs career he definitely wasn’t the fighter he was in a title defense and we have Tommy Laughran confirming that. A typical Greb ND vs Rosenbloom comes to mind Written up by the greatest Greb writer of them all, Regis Welsh of the Pittsburgh Post
    Harrys portrayed as breezing into Cleveland, indulging in a pre fight party at onna the finer hotels, the name escapes me, warning Maxie pre fight “hey kid don’t get fresh and i won’t hurt ya” Maxie seizing the opportunity gets fresh and nails Greb with a good one in the 4th......BIG MISTAKE!!!!!...as Maxie recollected for the rest of his life
    Grebs response was pure fury.
    Let’s just say MAXIE got very put in his place
     
    SLAKKA, Dec 2, 2011
    SLAKKA, Dec 2, 2011
    #15
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