America not having a successful HW for some time. Possible reasons?

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by bailey, Dec 4, 2011.


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  1. bailey

    bailey Loyal Member Full Member

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    Im surprised that nobody has considered the matching of fighters on the way up as a possibility
    Deontay Wilder who is 20-0 (20KOs). Looks impressive, but who has he fought?

    Now look at how much tougher the European HWs are matched on the way up

    Tyson Fury in 17 fights has fought undefeated 16-0 Pajkic, undefeated 14-0 Chisora, undefeated 13-0 Nascimento, undefeated 12-0 Power and McDermott twice

    Derek Chisora in 17 fights has fought undefeated 14-0 Fury, undefeated 16-0 Helenius, D Williams and S Sexton twice

    Robert Helenius in 17 fights has fought L Brewster, A Levin, S Peter, S Liakhovich, D Chisora and undefeated 12-0 G Tony

    Could it be because of soft matching on the way up, why American HWs have tended to crumble when facing decent European opposition who seem to be matched alot tougher on the way up?

    I figured these match ups could be the reason. If say one of the Klitschkos were to just give either Wilder, Fury, Helenius or Chisora (happend but fell through), Wilder would be the least prepared for a big fight even though he has had more fights
     
    bailey, Dec 4, 2011
    bailey, Dec 4, 2011
    #31
  2. eliqueiros

    eliqueiros Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    The reason is everyone running from David Rodriguez:deal

    He's coming for you HW's, he's coming....

    This content is protected
     
    eliqueiros, Dec 4, 2011
    eliqueiros, Dec 4, 2011
    #32
  3. bailey

    bailey Loyal Member Full Member

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    Very amusing, but even with all of his fights he has fought overall at a lesser level than what these guys arguably have and definately in the same sort of amount of fights
     
    bailey, Dec 4, 2011
    bailey, Dec 4, 2011
    #33
  4. Joe_MacKenzie

    Joe_MacKenzie Boxing Addict banned

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    There are still FAR more pro heavyweights in the USA than anywhere in the world:

    http://boxrec.com/ratings.php?country=US&sex=m&division=Heavyweight&status=A&SUBMIT=Go&pageID=16

    USA: 396 active heavyweights

    UK: 32 active heavyweights

    UA: 16 active heavyweights

    Russia: 18 active heavyweights

    Poland: 14 active heavyweights

    Finland: 3 active heavyweights


    The American heavyweights seem to be on average less fit and more likely to be overweight. I think that may have something to do with their poor performances in recent years.
     
    Joe_MacKenzie, Dec 4, 2011
    Joe_MacKenzie, Dec 4, 2011
    #34
  5. PityTheFool

    PityTheFool Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    More stringent drug testing?
    Only joking guys,there's a worldwide dearth of real quality.
     
    PityTheFool, Dec 4, 2011
    PityTheFool, Dec 4, 2011
    #35
  6. Bubby

    Bubby Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    No actually I didnt. And what did Haye do for you to say hes done more than all three? Was it the manly way he ran from Valuev and Wladimir? At least Arreloa did try to fight back...If Haye had stood for one second he would have got sparked fast....
     
    Bubby, Dec 4, 2011
    Bubby, Dec 4, 2011
    #36
  7. madballster

    madballster Loyal Member Full Member

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    America has been in a decline for a while. Not just boxing. It's a cultural thing. American supremacy is no longer a given. Being the world's #1 superpower has made Americans lazy, fat and arrogant.

    Now they're waking up and notice they're just out of many instead of being king of the hill like in the good old days.
     
    madballster, Dec 4, 2011
    madballster, Dec 4, 2011
    #37
  8. Threetime no1

    Threetime no1 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    :shock:NO...i don't think this is a great era in HW boxing, it's the worst.
    And i wasn't looking for you to big Lewis up, it's just a matter of fact he broke the US' long domination of the championship.

    I get it that it's just the way it is, but losing your grip on the HW championship just made matters worse. That's my point mate.
    When you said Lewis and the Klitschko's have nothing to do with it, is what i responded to.
    Of course they've had a hand in it, to say otherwise just isn't true. I know that boxing was declining over there from the late 80's, but having no HW champ hasn't helped matters.
     
    Threetime no1, Dec 4, 2011
    Threetime no1, Dec 4, 2011
    #38
  9. Threetime no1

    Threetime no1 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    :lol:Yes you did Bubby you liar. Don't make me look for it.

    Anyway the fact Haye was Cruiser champ and grabbed a belt at HW tells you he achieved more than any of these 3 men.

    Stop nitpicking.
     
    Threetime no1, Dec 4, 2011
    Threetime no1, Dec 4, 2011
    #39
  10. Arran

    Arran Boxing Junkie banned

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    he may be 0-2 but all boxing fans know hes really 1-1
     
    Arran, Dec 4, 2011
    Arran, Dec 4, 2011
    #40
  11. boxingbull

    boxingbull Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Two reasons, Other Countries are producing more boxers and the fact that it is more money to be made in the NFL and NBA.
     
    boxingbull, Dec 4, 2011
    boxingbull, Dec 4, 2011
    #41
  12. bailey

    bailey Loyal Member Full Member

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    America has more active HWs than all of Europe combined so even if NFL & NBA make more money it doesnt explain the situation so stop making silly excuses. Most European atheletes could probably make more money playing pro premiership football.
    I believe it is due to the way fighters are matched and then non prepared for a big step up, as my thread start page shows an example.
     
    bailey, Dec 4, 2011
    bailey, Dec 4, 2011
    #42
  13. bailey

    bailey Loyal Member Full Member

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    If this is the worst era ever (which I dont think it is), then more so, how come American HWs struggle to compete in this era?
     
    bailey, Dec 4, 2011
    bailey, Dec 4, 2011
    #43
  14. Bubby

    Bubby Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I think he's 1-1. But being 1-1 against top ten fighters doesn't mean he'd win over Chambers, Thompson or Arreloa...
     
    Bubby, Dec 4, 2011
    Bubby, Dec 4, 2011
    #44
  15. SoxNation

    SoxNation Well-Known Member Full Member

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    I never mentioned Lewis in my first post. Lewis isn't a part of this era of boxing and he didn't technically end American dominance. Ruiz, Bird, Rahman, Briggs and Brewster all held belts after Lewis retired and they were all terrible American fighters. Declining interest and participation in boxing ended U.S. dominance, because no one came after Tyson, Bowe and Holyfield once they were past the primes.

    Most people in the U.S. stopped caring about this division once Lewis retired. The last time a heavyweight fight got any real media attention here was when Wlad and Sultan "fought" at Madison Square Garden and people were booing them in the first round. The guys from the last era were replaced by mostly out of shape and talentless fighters. It wouldn't matter where they came from, because they weren't any good. Outside of Mayweather and Pacquiao, boxing gets almost no attention here anymore and the heavyweight division gets zero attention. Nobody cares about Eddie Chambers, the Kiltschko's or any other heavyweight, because they're boring and not very good.
     
    SoxNation, Dec 4, 2011
    SoxNation, Dec 4, 2011
    #45
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