What's the highest you can rank Ezzard Charles all time?

Bivins slugging it out with "Doc" Williams at the end of his career:

[dm]xlk5gh_jimmy-bivins_sport[/dm]

 

Top 10 for sure.... Lemme think..... I have him 6-8 range.

 

You've pretty much summed up my next 10 places flea. Harada is my 31, McLarnin 33 and Tunney 34.

Tbh, I have to include Big George simply because I don't feel like ice been far to the HWs. I could easily omit him and put him around 50th, but it's a little unfair tbh.

And I feel that Bivins certainly should be that high. His four year unbeaten record, for me, matches any 4 years in history, with wins over Lee Murray, Joey Maxim, Ezzard, Moore, Marshell and Burley (not sure if he was included in the 4 years off the top of my head) and he was robbed against Jersey IMO. it was only after this defeat did his record become mixed. Did his great opposition figure him out? Perhaps. Or was he showing signs of slowing and not looking as good? We will never really no.

Perhaps my rating of Elmer was a little foolish, but I do stand by my homo erotic love for Jersey Joe

Like I've said many times, I in no way consider myself an expert at the history of boxing, but I'm learning all the time. The reason I posted the list was to have others scrutinise it so I could learn more about those I left off and maybe re-evaluate the positioning.

 

If you haven't already, look into Eddie Booker, fascinating stuff.

 

Thanks TGA, hadn't seen that. His arms are the freakiest thing I've ever seen, Dalhsim like from SF2. That makes him more frustrating though, he gives up his range to come inside instead of boxing behind a 1-2, imagine how good he'd be if he actually did that

 

:deal

05/42: Charley Burley [51-5] (#2 MW) W10
06/42: Charley Burley [52-6](#2 MW) W10
10/42: Joey Maxim [20-5] (#8 LHW) W10
12/42: Joey Maxim [20-6] (#8 LHW) W10
01/43: Jimmy Bivins [31-5] (#1 LHW) L10
03/43: Lloyd Marshall [38-7] (#1 LHW) LK8
05/46: Archie Moore [79-11] (#1 LHW) W10
06/46: Lloyd Marshall [58-14] (#4 LHW) W-KO6
11/46: Jimmy Bivins [52-7] (#3 HW) W10
03/47: Jimmy Bivins [56-8] W-KO4
05/47: Archie Moore [83-12] (#2 LHW) W10
09/47: Lloyd Marshall [63-15](#7 LHW) W-KO2
01/48: Archie Moore [88-13] (#1 LHW) W-KO8
09/48: Jimmy Bivins [66-12] (#6 HW) W10
02/49: Joey Maxim [63-15] (#1 LHW) W15
06/49: Joe Walcott [44-13] (#1 HW) W15
09/50: Joe Louis [58-1] (#1 HW) W15
03/51: Joe Walcott [49-15] (#7 HW) W15
05/51: Joey Maxim [75-16] (#3 HW) W15

And plenty more where it came from. The L's he took aren't the greatest thing that could've happened. However, when you're consistently testing yourself against the best and still winning the majority, it's a lot less relevant.

Charles takes a dump on the vast majority of fighters you could call Great.

 

Good post.

You make a very compelling case.

 

Number 6

 

I would put Ezzard in the top 5 easily. In the 40s I saw him fight Walter Hafey and Lloyd Marshall in my hometown of Cincy and he was just great. A true middleweight who could handle himself against any fighter middleweight on up in history I think. I know a lot of people on here are big fans of Marvin Hagler. He was a great fighter, but to picture him agaist Ezzard in his prime is for me to picture him on his back. Ezzard never got his full credit I thought. You talk about the most avoided fighters in history and you talk about Ezzard as a middleweight and to a degree a lightheavy. LaMotta sure never called him out.

 

Welcome S,fellow oldtimer. I too saw Walter Hafer fight in MSG in the 1940s. I agree that Ezzard Charles as a middleweight was almost unbeatable, except for his loss to the forgotten Ken Overlin in 1941,Ezzard
would have been a handful for any MW since then, INCLUDING Marvin Hagler...:hi:

 

He's The Fourth God of War.

 

Would seem his stock has only risen with time.

 

As he should be. He beat two of the other nine five times. :good

 

Ezzard was top 5, I can not see him lower than 5 but has a case from 1-5 he was a warrior and had more hard battles than Spartacus but was skillful,smart and gallant

 

Sold. He's like Greb. Sometimes you just need to remind yourself all the folks he beat, how busy he was, and little he actually lost in his prime.