The All-Time Greats if they were modern lazy American heavyweights

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by cross_trainer, Jan 25, 2012.


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  1. cross_trainer

    cross_trainer Liston was good, but no "Tire Iron" Jones Full Member

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    Assume that Frazier, Foreman, Liston, Tyson, Ali, Louis, Patterson, Dempsey, Baer, etc. etc. all fight in the modern era, but that they adopt modern American heavyweights' lack of dedication, lazy training habits, and tendency to overeat.

    Who performs the best under these circumstances?

    (Just to be clear, they time-travel here during the years when they were prospects, not before or after).
     
    cross_trainer, Jan 25, 2012
    cross_trainer, Jan 25, 2012
    #1
  2. Garrus

    Garrus Big Boss 1935-2014 Full Member

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    Foreman
     
    Garrus, Jan 25, 2012
    Garrus, Jan 25, 2012
    #2
  3. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Foreman.
     
    McGrain, Jan 25, 2012
    McGrain, Jan 25, 2012
    #3
  4. cross_trainer

    cross_trainer Liston was good, but no "Tire Iron" Jones Full Member

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    Ingo might also do well, since he was already lazy and given to eating a bit much. Might erode a little faster without any culture of discipline behind him, though.

    Carnera would be even more freakishly huge.
     
    cross_trainer, Jan 25, 2012
    cross_trainer, Jan 25, 2012
    #4
  5. BritInvasion

    BritInvasion keepin on keepin on Full Member

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    Big George has kinda proved that he can do the fat fighter 'thang'. He has to be the pick as the old fat version proved he could thrive (relatively) so we have to assume that a young fat version will do at least as well?
    With Tyson, David Tua initially seems the most obvious comparitor (as well as his himself in his ring dotage), but I just feel a fat Tyson (without the gym intensity from his youth already 'in the bank') would be a nobody. His mental state precludes him from success without that amazing physicality of his prime.
    I think that 'intensity' thing is key here, really. Essentially, we're looking at who could thrive most without the intensity of their youth. Surely that rules out immediately Tyson, Dempsey, Frazier, Patterson?
    I like the sound of this lazy, fat, young genuis Ali! I imagine a charming James Toney : )
     
    BritInvasion, Jan 25, 2012
    BritInvasion, Jan 25, 2012
    #5
  6. Kalasinn

    Kalasinn ♧ OG Kally ♤ Full Member

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    Foreman.
     
    Kalasinn, Jan 25, 2012
    Kalasinn, Jan 25, 2012
    #6
  7. KOTF

    KOTF Bingooo Full Member

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    How many pounds would Ali weigh?
     
    KOTF, Jan 25, 2012
    KOTF, Jan 25, 2012
    #7
  8. PowerPuncher

    PowerPuncher Loyal Member Full Member

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    Dedication is personality not era based. Plenty of lazy HWs in every era. Even in this era, I think Brewster, Chambers and Brock showed up well trained and in good shape, but they just weren't that amazing HWs

    According to Dundee Ali was lazy in training
     
    PowerPuncher, Jan 25, 2012
    PowerPuncher, Jan 25, 2012
    #8
  9. Kalasinn

    Kalasinn ♧ OG Kally ♤ Full Member

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    Dundee may have a very different idea of what "lazy" means.
     
    Kalasinn, Jan 25, 2012
    Kalasinn, Jan 25, 2012
    #9
  10. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Whaaaaaaaaaaaat??

    Every SINGLE interview i've ever seen with him, he says Ali is the best trainer he ever worked with, that he loved the gym.
     
    McGrain, Jan 25, 2012
    McGrain, Jan 25, 2012
    #10
  11. aj415

    aj415 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Ali won an Olympic gold medal during a high tide in the sports following popularity and participation by being lazy...
     
    aj415, Jan 25, 2012
    aj415, Jan 25, 2012
    #11
  12. cross_trainer

    cross_trainer Liston was good, but no "Tire Iron" Jones Full Member

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    Somewhere between 230 and 240, probably. (Higher end is more likely). He may have a little more muscle weight, too.
     
    cross_trainer, Jan 25, 2012
    cross_trainer, Jan 25, 2012
    #12
  13. Guyfawkes

    Guyfawkes Than who was phone?! Full Member

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    Foreman would do almost as well, a fat young Foreman might be forced to slow down and be more patient like in his older days, Fat Ali would not be good, he relied too much on speed and reflexes to get all blubbery.
     
    Guyfawkes, Jan 25, 2012
    Guyfawkes, Jan 25, 2012
    #13
  14. Conn

    Conn Well-Known Member banned Full Member

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    Muhammad Ali WAS the archetypal "fat lazy american heavyweight" !

    throughout the 1970s at least. (except a couple of fights where he actually trained and didn't fool around).

    he got away with it because he had a lot of talent and those very fast hands, and he was cunning.
     
    Conn, Jan 25, 2012
    Conn, Jan 25, 2012
    #14
  15. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    And because he wasn't very fat.
     
    McGrain, Jan 25, 2012
    McGrain, Jan 25, 2012
    #15
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