Historically, why doesn't Rocky Marciano get his just dues?

You mean the fat slobs of today who are huffing and puffing after a few rounds of..."ahem"...action?

 

As usual, the Rocky threads never stop ... as usual, the truth is somewhere between the two extremes, the nuthuggers and the dismissers ...

 

Like Ike and Tua who combined for a record 1700+ punches over 12 rounds.

 

Well, Rocky never beat a great fighter who was in his prime so, to me, that disqualifies him from any mention as an all-time great. Wasn't his fault, it's just a fact. Nobody knows if he could have stood up to a young, fast strong heavyweight because he never did it. Carmine Vingo? Is this the same "monster" his fans always tout as proof that Rocky would murder a fighter of any size? Just for the record, Vingo was hardly a murderous puncher with only 7 KO's in his 16 wins. Also, as has been pointed out, despite his height, he didn't weight that much more than Rocky.

I think that Rocky could have competed with any pre-1960 heavyweight as his size, slowness and short arms wouldn't have been that much of a handicap. Post 1960, the fighters just got too big, too strong and were too skilled for someone like Rocky.

 

Neither did Holmes, and he can be rated anywhere from 2 to 10 depending on one's standing. Both are ATG's.

 

Most universally recognized being in the top five heavies of all time that I've seen and discussed. Mills Lane had a list I read some time where he said, Jack Johnson, Ali, Joe Louis, Dempsey and Marciano were the top five.

Heavyweight perfection by record alone? Marciano is #1 I think he's judged a bit harsh by who immediately came after him and where he stood because of his tragic death. His record is impressive for it's time. Would have loved to have seen him go toe to toe with Floyd or Sonny.

 

He seems to be in everyone's top 3 heavyweight list. I don't think anyone can say he's underrated.

 

He beat everyone worth mentioning in that era (bar Valdez who Moore KO'd anyway) and usually did it in very convincing fashion especially in the rematches, what more can you ask? Pretty remarkable given how late he started the fight game. He had the greatest stamina of any heavyweight ever, the craziest workrate, great chin, great power, indomitable will and spirit with a underrated defense and rythm breaking style that gave everybody he ever faced absolute hell, theres not a man sub 200lbs id favour over him in a H2H match. He's my number 3 for Heavyweights which is not at all underrated...

 

This is quite a sadistic, brutal affair. I can't in my right mind pick Marciano to beat Sonny Liston. However, I think he'd put up what would be one of the most valiant efforts of all-time. Throw the intimidation factor out the window. That's horse **** to somebody like Rocky.

Marciano gets stopped, but probably not before he caves a few ribs in himself.

 

Sadly, that's how i see it too especially cos if Rocky stuck around this long he would've been well over the hill. I heard a story that Rocky and Sonny were having lunch and Sonny made a crack that Rocky couldn't beat him and Rocky told him to go get his gear He really was something else.

 

Tough, tough fight.

Ultimately, it leads to a discussion such as this one. And I can't evaluate it any better than McGrain already did.

 

Skill wise Marciano is massively underrated boxer, people talk about his power or endurance, which are strengths but what's underrated is his skillset. James Toney studied Marciano to improve his skillset along with Charles, Walcott and Moore. That says allot in my view. The more you learn the more you appreciate his skills and boxing brain. You grow to appreciate his efficiency and his ability to pace himself while boxing smart, his defence, his punch selection, his positioning and punch technique.

 

He's one of the boxers i really came to appreciate in here. He had far more finesse than i ever gave credit for. Now he's no Pep, but he sure had some cute moves.

 

Most who faced the Rock said he was hard to time, hard to hit clean and broke your rythm which is a monumentally important aspect in the fight game. Boxing is usually played out like a game of chess you do something, then your opponent, then you etc. but being able to not allow your opponent to get off, to build his confidence, get a rythm going, get adequate room for his punching is a such an advantage but so rarely done it's criminal and the Rock did this very well.

 

I'm not sure i see him in many top 3's at all. Could be wrong.