Welliver Beats Down Mensah, Forces Him To Flee Ring In The 10th

The issue here is marketability...name recognition. Keep in mind that even Sauerland was considering staging Holy vs Povetkin for the title.

Boxing is a business as much as it is a sport. Tickets need to be sold, TV execs need to know they're broadcasting a show that lots of households will watch. That's where a brand name like "Holyfield" comes in.

Lots of up-and-coming prospects would love a piece of Holy, for the obvious reasons. It makes sense business-wise.

 

No fighter that has big promotional backing of his own (either an established contender, or a hot up-and-coming prospect) will go to China to fight Chauncy, you are correct.

On the other hand, numerous tough, Tier 2 heavyweights who don't have big promotional backing (Ibragimov and Oqeundo are only two examples, I can think of several more) definitely will go to China to fight Chauncy. Those guys would love a chance to leapfrog back into the alphabet top-10, and they're confident they've got the edge on Chauncy.

Problem is, Chauncy's backers will never accept the Tier 2 guys such as the ones I mentioned (and again, I can think of several more) because the risk/reward ratio is very poor.

Matchmaking is everything in boxing...poor matchmaking means the "A" side could get knocked off.

 

I dont know why Welliver doesnt tap into the Australian market too. Hes already based in the New Zealand area some. Fighting those from Australia could make it kinda be a Down Under rivalry thing. There are some step ups he could take against those in Australia: (better opponents are there certainly, especially compared to New Zealand...I mean how many times can you seriously box Daniel Tai)

Mark De Mori
Solomon Haumono
Alex Leapai
Kali Meehan

 

The people behind Di Mori and Haumono are trying to build those guys up, and are probably not yet be willing to put them in with Chauncy. At least not for peanuts, on a promotion controlled by Chauncy's backers. Chauncy would be too much for both of them right now...would knock off their upward mobility.

Meehan would be a great fight for Chauncy. If Chauncy wins, he establishes credibility immediately, and puts an end to the criticism he's been getting. But Meehan has an alpha world rating and a big name. This means that he'd want a lot of money for the bout, and I'm sure Chauncy and Roland would want a decent paycheck too. To make this fight, there would have to be TV money involved, to pay the purses. Is Aussie/NV/Chinese TV interested in this fight?

What I just explained about Meehan holds true for Leapai too. Leapai is semi-established right now, and his backers would want good compensation for Chauncy vs. Alex. Is there TV demand for this fight?

Remember that the risks are high in any Chauncy/Meehan/Leapai matchups. The loser gets dropped from the alpha ratings, forfeits his regional belts, and forgoes his upward mobility. Therefore, all parties will not make these fights without careful forethought, with particular emphasis on the money.

 

Looks to me like Leapai is presently at the forefront of the Chauncy/Meehan/Leapai race in OZ/NZ. Leapai has beaten Travis Walker, which is nothing to sneeze at. Leapai would be best off if he could get a showdown with Meehan, who is now in his 40s, is slow on his feet, and might therefore be a stationary target for Leapai's bombs.

 

Toney was a horrible decision, but I watched the McCall fight live and that fight easily could have gone either way. All of the scorecards were reasonable.

I don't love Welliver either, but you have to admit, Fres is a guy who takes rounds off and Welliver isn't. So if Oquendo probably gives him 4 rounds by just taking them off, you don't think Welliver can outwork Oquendo to win 3 of the other 8 rounds? I think that's probably a close fight.

Just out of curiosity, who are the 2nd tier guys you keep talking about but haven't mentioned by name who want Welliver but he won't give them a chance?

I don't necessarily disagree with you (I think Welliver would lose to anyone in the top 10 other than maybe Dimitrenko if you rate him there), but just curious who.

 

Leapai-Walker was a very fun fight, but the stoppage in that fight was one of the worst I've seen. Leapai's another one I wish would **** or get off the pot already. Meehan at least has stepped up a number of times.

 

Speaking from a stylistic/tactical/physical perspective, how do you perceive Meehan-Leapai turning out?

My hypothesis is that at this point, Kali lacks the legs and tactical equipment necessary to keep a strong guy on the outside. Even in earlier years, Kali had trouble with strong dudes who could force their way inside and overwhelm him (look at the Rahman fight). The films suggest that Kali's most recent foes -- overmatched tune-up opponents -- were able to force their way inside, too, before getting leveled.

My guess is that Leapai -- a hard bombing infighter -- has a field day with Kali (no disrespect to Meehan).

 

I saw the fight in person, very close to the ring. Fres was really the only one scoring for most of the fight, albeit he never put more than one or two punches together at a time. It looked to me as if Fres won at least 7 rounds, and could easily have been given 9 rounds.

The philosophy for giving McCall rounds is that he constantly walked Oquendo down...he never stopped for a single second. By contrast, Fres ran. But in almost every moment, Fres was the only guy getting his jabs off. Oliver rarely connected with anything.

Oliver won the 8th clearly by landing the booming body shot. He might have shared points (or possibly won) one of the earlier rounds, just maybe. In the 10th, 11th, and 12th, Oliver scored more effectively, having his best rounds, arguably. However, even in these stanzas, Oquendo gave at least as good as he took, seeming to score with more clean shots than his foe.

If you judge a bout based on who did the most effective, clean, punching, then Oquendo won by far. He didn't look very impressive at all, but he won, really.

As the fight progressed, and even after the final bell, everyone around me regarded as a foregone conclusion that Oquendo had the fight wrapped up.

Remember, Oliver was the promoter's fighter. Oquendo was the out-of-towner. Keep in mind also that Oliver was a sentimental favorite with most people sitting near the ring, and in the audience. This may explain why the boxing press didn't make enough noise about the questionable verdict.

 

First, I'm not a Welliver hater. I'm just waiting for him to step up. If he turns out to be an effective slapping/slashing, fast, combo punching light-hitting fancy dan (an Adamek knock off), then I will be one of his fans. I'm just waiting for him to show me.

What intrigues me about your analysis (that I've quoted), is that you claim to know how Welliver fights and functions in the ring. How do you know? The only credible film evidence available to us is the Solis fight.

Are you basing your views strictly on the Solis fight? How do you really know what you claim to see in Welliver? I doubt that you've seen his other fights on TV.

Concerning your analysis of Fres-Welliver, I disagree. The lackadaisical approach you see is what Fres does when he's fighting someone who can potentially threaten him effectively on the inside, or who can punch and throw a hailstorm of punches. Fres runs, slips and slides in these instances, and consequently neglects offense.

But against a light-hitting, center ring boxer, Fres is in his element. He'll won't feel the need to back away, and will likely control the situation by constantly pumping his jab. His punch output isn't great even in these cases, but he tends to be the only one connecting, and feels comfortable holding his ground. I believe that Chauncy-Fres will turn out like this.

In short, Chauncy fights Fres's fight...he does what Fres does, only Fres does it better.

 

come on man...its a fraud. holyfields last fight had less than a 1,000 people there

 

agree with you on Dimitrenko..how his name ever gets mentioned is beyond me. the guy has done nothing his entire career

 

I don't know that these guys "want" Welliver, or that Chauncy "won't" give them a chance. I'm just saying I know that they are available to travel to China, are not connected to promoters, have a vast edge in experience over Chauncy, have little to lose, and would likely take short money in China/NZ just to get a chance at poaching his belts.

I've already mentioned two names: Ibragimov and Oquendo. I believe Cedric Boswell is in this category too. Oliver McCall was ready to take a Chauncy fight recently. Come back here a little later, and I'll give you a fuller list of names.

As I see it, Chauncy is now just breaking into the "B" leagues. The guys I've mentioned are at the very, very top of the "B" leagues. Thus, Chauncy has to prove himself against them before we can talk seriously about his prospects against authentic Tier 1 guys.

No disrespect to Chauncy...I like tracking the upward mobility of "B" league dudes, it's especially nice to see them blossom into "real" contenders. Maybe Chauncy gets there.

But for now, my guess is that Chauncy has some developing to do before he's ready for the names I mentioned above.

Again, come back here later...I'll give a fuller list of "B" league aces who might be a step-too-high for Chauncy right now, given that he's on a learning curve.

 

I think you're right. Meehan is a stationary target at this point, and while Leapai doesn't have great defense, Meehan is just so slow at this point that he probably won't be able to catch Leapai coming inside.

But I suspect Welliver beats both of them. Leapai has awful stamina and his technique isn't really any better than Welliver's. If Welliver weathers the early storm (which I think he would), he should be able to dominate the late rounds on workrate.

 

Chauncy is still C league..he needs to beat a more credible opponent before he can jump up a class....Mensah and Calloway dont get you into the B class