So where does Hopkins rank now all-time?

Personally I believe jones would have prevented hopkins from becoming number 1 for as long as he was in the division.

That's no big deal though because if charles would have remained at lhw I don't think moore would ever reach number 1 neither.

 

:good

 

There's no consensus top anything but there absolutely is an individual top so many.

 

I don't believe in pound-for-pound lists.
It's nice to say some guy "is one of the greatest ever, in any class", but they all belong in a weight class, or weight classes. That's where you can judge them against others.

I guess some of you rate Hopkins high pound-for-pound because he won the title in two weight classes, (among other reasons), and that's ok. His total achievements across the board, his overall longevity, that makes sense, I see the reasoning.
But I don't always rate weight-jumping as a boxing achievement in itself
Sometimes a guy moves up because someone better came along in his original class.

I don't see it as any more of a "pound for pound" credit that he came up and beat Tarver rather than if he'd stayed down and knocked Taylor the hell out.
Of course, he easily beat the man who beat Taylor, and that's good.

So, anyway, I can only rate them in weight classes. Hopkins was an excellent middleweight champion, but I haven't been convinced that he's been special at light-heavy. And that's understandable, he's a very old fighter

 

Pound for pound imo is just assessing a guys career over any weightclass not a specific weightclass.

In simple terms it's a question of "overall who had the better career" that's what I judge p4p on. I do it resume, achievement and skillset (measured on a fighter's best ever performance)

 

One of the greatest in recent times and one of the greatest in his weightclass. More there is not to say.

 

Hopkins avoided the Jones Jr rematch. Benard knows boxing and he knows his limitations, he even avoided the Jones rematch in '07, same as he avoided Chad Dawson as long as possible

 

He played his cards right - some still believe it was Jones who avoided Hopkins

 

Fixed

 

I know Bernard Hopkins. Duck isn't in his vocabulary, nor is fear. The chip on his should prevented the Jones fight, nothing more.

And while the actual fight means little, he won every round when he fought Jones again, and his own body is seriously starting to fade. He mauled Jones, whose speed meant nothing.

I still agree with my father that his skills in a bit of a younger form could have figured Jones out the same way Montell Griffin was doing before he got fouled.

 

You are fast becoming one of my very favourite posters. You are so solid over such a variety of topics and about as biased as a dead straight line. One of very very few that can balance the present with the past.

 

And why did he only get in the ring with Dawson when it was part of the Pascal, why did he not fight Calzaghe after being offered the money he requested? He was so proud that he didn't want to avenge an ass kicking to a 1 handed Jones for career high money? The word 'duck' may not be part of his limited vocabulary, but he certainly knows how to do it even if he can't define it :yep

Yes because he's not at all a little bit biased here 'the same way Montell Griffin was doing before he got fouled'

 

Montell Griffin was winning the fight. Roy was so frustrated he couldn't stop punching after his breakthrough. He admits it, the film shows it. So, whats the problem?

He came out in the second fight tight as rubber band and blew Griffin away in one of his sharpest technical displays, but in the first fight, he was trying to be Roy Jones, and he was getting outboxed by a very limited, not at all great 175er. His improving between the two fights shows discipline and determination to not make the mistakes he was making the first night, but he did make them against other fighters, and Hopkins in top form would have been the best pure technician he ever thought about fighting.

The most fearsome 160-175 ever, but just enough holes in the skills part of his game that I'd back Hopkins in 2001-now. If thats bias, then I'm bias.

I'll lay on the table I've trained with B-Hop, who showed my father an incredible amount of respect and deference, taught me a thing or two about work ethic, and bought my kid lunch when I was on the road, so I really like the guy.

I like Roy as well, but I've never spent time in a gym with him, just ringside at one of his events, and a couple of meals. Both class A gentleman, fearless, great, and hilarious.

 

hopkins hasn't ducked anyone it'sa complete myth.

a mw champ not making an agreement to fight the lhw champ is not a duck.

he's never ducked calzaghe neither, infact he fought joe when joe was a top 3 p4p fighter! right after joe had become a superstar in boxing.

he's never ducked dawson, infact he fought pascal who had just beaten dawson, twice and he has now twice made a fight with dawson.

hopkins and ducking is a ridiculous claim.

 

Only to a fan of boxing can you still be ducking a dude you've fought, or somebody bigger than you.

Fighting Dawson twice is enough. He's not ducking the guy. He fought the dude who beat Dawson and was ranked higher.

He wanted to fight Calzaghe after Jones, and Joe retired. Neither ducked either.

And you never hold it against the guy moving up to make a fight if you've ever negotiated a contract in this sport. Every single advisor a fighter has, if he pays the right people, are gonna tell him to not go up 15 pounds to fight the best guy in the sport. If JONES really wanted the fight(Neither needed it), he had to go get it.

Same reason Floyd is screwing himself now. Bernard wanted a ton of money(Whether its fair or not is absolutely debatable, but if there were a weight class for 7 foot, 300 pound guys, I'd probably want a ton of money to go fight them too...Especially if I had just beaten Wlad Klitschko and wanted to preserve the status that gave me) and Roy didn't want the fight enough to give an inch on 60-40. No ducking went on in that situation.