The Unpopular Opinion Thread

Boxing skills can indeed be overcome if you have enough of everything else.

It is, after all, mostly a mental game. Hit a guy hard, back him up, make him feel tired and pressed, and those skills will start to fade.

My Dad used to tell me and my brothers, "I don't care how good he is. You kids are PUNCHERS. Every time you hit him, it'll take a year of his boxing skill away from him. Clobber him good a few rounds, it'll be a sparring session by the end."

Max Baer exemplifies this. Those he couldn't cold **** outright, he usually had so cowed and broken that he beat them anyway, including Schmeling.

 

Yes, and all of that is most true at heavyweight.

Find the guy who hits the hardest and takes the hardest hit ... at heavyweight level ... he's bound to be a world class fighter, regardless of his lack of "skills".

 

Its a hard thing to explain. It HAS to be felt in ones life to truly understand it.

I felt like that against Klitschko. At a certain point, you are being outclassed, and you fall into allowing it to happen. At my very best, I landed some shots, I slipped a few, I pressed. Then he hit me, and I was dancing like Ali, which is the antithesis of what I do in the ring. It is a bizarre phenomenon, but it is why punchers can still dominate without knocking a foe out.

Sometimes, you'd rather stay upright and lose, for some reason. Isn't even about heart or cowardice. I find the idea hard to articulate, as its more of a gut feeling I've experienced.

 

Interesting stuff, but not something I'm going to put on my "Must experience before I die" list (and the chances of dying could be real here ...)

:good

I think I heard Marvin Hagler once saying, while on a live commentary team, that ... "those kind of punches, like one uppercut I remember taking from John The Beast Mugabi, made me question my existence."

 

I remember getting hit once and immediately thinking,

"This is stupid. I'm in a ring, getting hit by a man for money. Why the hell do people think this is a good idea?"

It was chilling.

 

Yeah, I expect even the greatest fighters probably get that feeling some time or another.
But with guys like Ali, Marciano and Hagler the thought "I can do that do to you better than you just did to me", "POW ! Take that mother****er" probably overrides it before it becomes a conscious thought

:good

 

As not to sidetrack this thread, I shall give an unpopular opinion!

Old George Foreman would have been in with a chance against the Lennox Lewis that was fighting when he beat Briggs.

Pernell Whitaker schools Roberto Duran at 135, but loses the same way to the same Ray Leonard Duran schooled at 147.

 

From pretty much the walker law onwards, boxing hasn't significantly progressed enough such that a modern fighter should be automatically favoured over their 1920's counterpart.

I think the only exception to this is the hw division as I have no difficulty believing that wlad is just as skilled as dempsey was, but he's a heck of a lot bigger.

 

Jose Napoles would stop Thomas Hearns late.

 

I think boxing has progressed geometrically since 2000.

 

I can relate, everybody whose felt my punch tells me i have heavy hands as my coach wisely puts it "You hit like a **** now all we need is some skill" I notice the effect it has on people in the ring. Any time i spar with someone and they get a bit too frisky or confident i'll unload a punch that immediatley makes them modest and conservative. It happened when i was sparring with my dad, i was doing some ali type moves, showboating, then my dad hit me with a jab thats the heaviest punch ive ever felt. When you get hit like that it takes some confidence out of you and makes you fight more conservativley
As we know Max had a hell of a right hand, bucket loads of stamina and probably the greatest chin of any heavyweight champion ever and soemtimes thats all you need. Does anyone really see him losing to guys like Arreola, Peter or better yet guys closer to his size like adamek and haye?

 

At the end of the 1920's boxing took huge steps forward skills wise and hasn't changed since (in regards to skill)
If Pacqiauo fought in the 40's he wouldn't be a blip on the screen
If Ali wasn't born Liston and Foreman would be talked about as the greatest heavyweights of all time
Gene Fullmer is most underrated middleweight ever
Abe Simon would win an alphabet belt if he fought today

 

Neither Armstrong, Whitaker, Ross or McLarnin are top ten all time welterweights in a H2H sense.

 

Ray Mancini, if rematched with Alexis Arguello, would probably be victorious.

 

Out of curiousity who's your top 10 H2H welters, Sweet Scientist?