Ken Norton v Tony Galento

*** comes gliding into the room, like a dog who's been offered a porter house steak******

 

I think you are confusing Smokin Bert Cooper with the Dark Knight Sir Bert Cooper.

 

Yes...

"sir" Bert is the one I am thinking of.. AKA Count Cooper

 

you are aware that Cooper entered that fight after a long night of partying and still being fairly hung over aren't you? His fault of course, but that shouldn't reflect what his abilities were when he was well trained and prepared.

That's a shame.. because you missed several excellent fights that came after the Foreman loss.

Was a geriatric Weaver any worse than Al Gainer?

 

Seriously though, Bert Cooper would have a good shot at beating Galento.

 

Well, the stupid ****er shoudl have learned from Walker, Galento and Wepner that one doesn't sober up after partying before a fight.

Oh, I've seen some of the clips after the fact, but I certainly didn't waste my time watching him live. (I'd rather spend those irretrievable moments here shooting the **** with you guys.)

Gainer beat Tiger Jack Fox decisively over the championship distance the following year, later drew with Fox in Boston, and went the championship distance in a Bronx loss. He went the 12 round limit with a peaking John Henry Lewis in his very next bout. Gainer was a hellraiser who was never stopped in 107 bouts, and may well be a top 25 all time LHW.

One might think Gainer-Galento was filmed in live sound, being the semifinal to Schmeling-Louis I. I've long suspected a butt was involved, something footage could be useful in determining. Neither was shy about rematches, but the two never squared off again. Gainer dealt successfully with plenty of other HWs, so a return may have been promotable.

 

The crucial point, it that he never gave any indication that he had problems with fighters of that style at world level.

Norton gave clear indications that he had problems with fighters of Galento's style.

There comes a point where stylistic dynamic trumps class, and this might just be such a case.

 

Fighters of Galento's style? Norton was taken out by Foreman, Shavers, and Cooney. I could be oblivious to other points being made, but it seems that it's Norton's knock out losses that are being mentioned as to why Norton would be knocked out by Galento. All 3 of these men set up their attacks and displayed skill sets that I have never seen Galento display.

Maybe I'm watching different things than others (for example I've never been blown away by what I've seen of Jack Johnson) and I'm not seeing what others are seeing in Galento.

When I watch Galento, I see a 5'9, pudgy man crudely throw punches and have a great deal of difficulty maintaining proper distance for himself. His punch technique is litterally that of what he was, a wild bar brawler. Yes, it is obvious that he punched very hard, however he still lacked the set up required to take Norton out. I don't see him over powering Norton the way Shavers, Foreman, and Cooney did. I see him pushing on Norton to no avail and being hit with hard punches as he comes in with next to no defense.

 

Watch the slow motion replays from multiple angles of his putting Louis on the deck. He actually beat the Bomber to the punch with a shorter, quicker shot than Joe was attempting to execute. His hook wasn't a wind up roundhouse shot, but a short deadly thud, faster and quicker with a much tighter arc than the hook Shavers initially stunned Norton with. He clearly had faster hands than Foreman.

No, he didn't apply lateral movement or subtle footwork to set up ideal angles, and he couldn't with his stature, nor would he need to with Ken. He'd go right after the slow starting Norton. Unlike Bobick, he was perfectly comfortable doing that. Unlike a shot and out of shape Jerry Quarry, he also wouldn't gas if Ken was able to get out of the gate, as Tony demonstrates over eight rounds with Ettore. Galento could sustain pressure with leveraged power.

If Norton does stop him, it has to be on cuts. Ken did do this to McMurray, JQ and Stander, while Tony was stopped by Neil Clisby, Marty Gallagher and Gainer in this way. But if any knockdowns occur, or anybody winds up on ***** street, it's definitely going to be Ken that's the victim.

 

Even the most crude of punchers can throw a well executed punch once in a while. The majority of Galento's punches were still wild, telegraphed, and seriously lacking good technique.

Galento also smothered his own attacks by getting way too close to his oponents, as he did frequently against Ettore. I wouldn't have as much of a problem with Galento's crude style if he managed to maintain proper distance and didn't smother his own attacks, however, the fact of the matter is that he did and it made him a less effective fighter.

This is essentially how I picture this fight:

Fight starts, Galento goes at Ken, eats some hard jabs and right hands, starts swinging away, ends up getting far too close and smothers Ken. They get broken apart, the same thing happens. Soon Tony's face would be battered and bloody from Ken's hard jabs and right hands. Staying aggressive, Tony would continue to come at Ken but still getting too close and they end up needing to be broken apart. The punches that Tony throws would be mostly blocked, rolled with, or glancing blows that do little damage.

By the mid to late rounds Galento is very bloody and swollen and Ken is landing at will with his over hand right, left hook, and jolting jabs. The ref stops the fight with Galento standing but taking a lot of abuse.

Galento's lack of defense, lack of distance control, and lack of set up for his attacks would be his downfall. Norton would have no problems hitting Tony and I think he could block most of Tony's attacks.

Even against George Foreman, Ken did well at the start of the fight. He moved well and was jabbing well. The reason Foreman was able to get to Ken so quickly was because he was setting things up with his jab and managing distance very well. Galento would not be setting things up with his jab, he'd just be rushing at Ken in his sporatic attacks with next to no distance control.

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Against Earnie Shavers, once again, Norton was not just crudely bullrushed. Earnie was throwing his jab to back Ken up and to set up his attack. Shavers landed several bombs before Norton finally dropped, these bombs were educated punches too. Earnie, while swinging for the fences, continued to throw with decent technique, didn't telegraph the punches, and was clearly aiming for certain spots. Galento tended to just swarm with a wild array of lefts and rights that he didn't really aim and were telegraphed.

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Cooney started out throwing his jab, but once Ken's back touched the ropes he opened up throwing educated, brutal hooks and uppercuts. Unlike Galento, he was not telegraphing his attack and he varied it up very well while mainting good punch technique and accuracy. Cooney also quickly spun out of being smothered and unleashed his attack. Galento would continue smothering until it was broken up, thus ruining his attack's effectiveness.

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Now let's compare those films of the 3 most famous (and 3 of the 4) times Norton was knocked out to the film of Galento's aleged best performance on film.

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As mentioned several times, there was much smothering and holding by Galento due to his complete lack of distance control...unlike Foreman, Shavers, and Cooney, who all managed distance very well. Galento did not set his attack up at all, he continued to just rush at Ettore and continued ending up too close. HIs defense was seriously lacking, Ettore didn't mount much of an offence because he felt overwhelmed, but notice, even against Foreman and Shavers, Norton was countering them with left hooks and uppercuts when in closer than he'd like. Against Galento, not only would he be hitting him on the way in, but he'd be landing hard counter shots when in close and he would be blocking and rolling with Galento's punches.

I see Galento having serious troubles getting past Ken's jab and right hand, particularly the overhand right. Even if he did manage to get past it, he'd end up swinging at Ken with little technique and getting too close or getting countered with hard hooks and uppercuts. It's a lose-lose for Galento in my opinion. He'd be outboxed on the outside, and countered with shorter, crisper shots on the inside.

 

I for one didn't see anything particularly spectacular about that shot Galento hit Louis with.. It was a clean shot, resulting in a flash knockdown the Louis immediately rose from and didn't even seem rattled.



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