Roy Jones Jr vs Bob Fitzsimmons by Bert Sugar

I'm shocked, to be honest. I agree with him, though.

 

Sugar was won over by the Jones Jr hype and was among those claiming him the as greatest next best thing... He like the rest of us learned different.

Sugar is not a past is neccessarily better man, he is a self promoter and knows what to say to stay in vogue, he is a Boxing historian "General", bits & bites about lots of fighters, BUT NOT a serious scholar or researcher on all things Pugulistic...

don't treat as gospel.

 

Had Roy retired at 34 years old, as heavyweight belt holder, 48-1 with the one loss being a DQ, holder of god knows how many belts, he would have rightly been in the top-15 P4P all-time. His fights were generally not even close and often had shockingly violent ends.

But as Classicists weigh heavily a fighter's intelligence in when to call it quits and love to pile on regarding losses at a time when said fighters should be long retired.

 

God do I despise this way of thinking.

 

What do you mean?

 

I do as much as i can to avoid paying serious attention to Sugar.

Hes right for once here though.

 

I'm on board with ya there.

 

Please to elaborate. Had Roy quit when Roy should have, and when most sensible boxers do, he would have had quite a resume, would have looked fantastic on film, have beaten two of the very best boxers of his generation, and would have had one loss by DQ. Your reasoning, if I am to assume, suggests Roy was around for 50 fights against world class opposition, hiding weaknesses that were only exposed in his 36th year. The previous decade plus as a professional fighter he was able to conceal these flaws, against some of the best of his generation. So, Roy didn't get old. He got exposed. Is this correct?

 

some people are nostalgic sure, some people aren't historians, sure...

But you Seamus are "set in stone", yes you have good knowledge, better than me I'm sure - but you are Sold on Modern is Tops... OK fair enough, But how can people refuse point blank certain unchangeable facts.

DOZENS & HUNDREDS of fights,
MOSTLY against TOP fighters
THOUSANDS of fighters, making COMP much, much harder
8 Divisions = ONE (1), CHAMPION
YEARS at the Top
and YEARS in, and 30, 40, 50 fights before getting near National titles, World classification and/or world rankings...

Fighting at your Natural weight (RRJ would have been a L-HW cum HW, Hopkins too
it just goes on & on

there IS NO Comparrison.

but I give up, you win.

 

I'm shocked Sugar didn't go for the old timer. But then again anyone picking someone with this stance over the fastest P4P hands in history is mentally ******ed or in denial

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And can someone tell me what's going on here?

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Seamus, he still achieved those exact achievements.

I don't understand those who give points for an early retirement.

Fitz is truly one of the greatest ever and his skills do stand the test of time but someone who in them days was classed as a defensive wizard counter puncher would probably be seen now as a heavy handed boxer puncher.

If fitz lands on a lhw, he wins imo. Maybe only greb has the required chin to avoid the ko.

That being said, roy is my choice for lhw h2h king. People can harp on about past prime losses but they don't mean anything to me.

The tarver ko loss initially looked bad to me, but knowing what we now know, I can summise that without the drastic draining he'd have more strength, more energy and would have been more likely to beat the count had he been prime.

Even the great ezzard charles or gene tunney or archie moore are not guys I favour to beat jones. Honestly he has the ability to pot shot his way to victory over anyone from mw to lhw.

In theory greb's relentless pressure and angles could cause problems but without film I can't give him the benefit of the doubt.

The next best style to beat him would be timed counter shots, but noone, to date, has demonstrated the timing to beat that speed consistently over a full fight.

Every so often maybe fitz, langford, foster and moore do stop him, but a punchers's chance isn't something i'd bet on.

Would roy stop fitz? I doubt it. James j came from behind to physical overwhelm him but over than that he never came close to being stopped in his prime and the more aggressive roy is the more open he is to a counter shot so i'd say he plays it safe to a wide ud.