Bonovena vs. Foreman - Durability

Bonavena is probably the greatest win Ellis produced, but Ringo was coming on with Jimmy tiring by the end. In their December 1968 rematch over the championship distance, even a pressing Frazier was tiring as the final bell approached.

Ellis, Folley and Ali were all master boxers with speed and pinpoint accuracy who could apply an element of sudden surprise. Trying to hammer Oscar down with brute force though simply didn't work. Frazier couldn't do it, Lyle couldn't do it, and Leotis was actually defeated by Bonavena. When Ringo was confronted by tremendous physical strength, he took the decision over Chuvalo, utilizing movement and foot speed he might not be expected by many to have possessed.

Yes, I do think he had superior durability to Foreman, and in a H2H showdown, if George can't wipe him out early (say, within the first half dozen rounds), he might find himself in very serious trouble with the Argentinian.

 

Foreman by Tko sometime around the 4th or 5th

i just don't see Oscar getting out of the way of enough of Georges huge, powerful shots, and Imo he cant hurt George really
But i do think Oscar goes out on his feet, becouse of his toughness

 

:happy

 

Hi Guyfawkes. I have to disagree with you here. If Oscar can hurt Ali (and he did hurt him BADLY in that 9th round) he can hurt any heavyweight in history.

 

And we can't ever forget that, "He'll be mine in nine!" was Ali's own knockout prediction for winning.

I just watched some of Bonavena-Chuvalo. Yes, I DO think Oscar could get out of the way of Foreman's huge and powerful but slower telegraphed shots, successfully absorb them when they did connect, circle counterclockwise as needed (like Morrison did decades later on an older, wiser Big George), and he was strong enough to stand up to Foreman when necessary, an effective, neutralizing clincher.

Assuming he had lived, Ringo may have been just the guy to dethrone a post Manila Ali in a title rematch before anybody else did. (He was on a seven fight winning streak when he was killed.) Along with Lyle and Shavers, Bonavena was yet another Norton managed to evade en route to his rubber match title shot at Muhammad.

 

I think George edges him out in durability, in a sense George was never KD in his 'prime' he just bulldozed through everyone and i think he'd do the same to Bonavena as someone else said like the Chuvalo TKO, every KD George had was post Ali when his confidence was shot to ****.

 

Also it would be an interesting sight to see them at the stare off Bonavena being about 5'10 and Foreman 6'4

 

:deal..Yes, the awkwardly..at times "clever" Bonavena may have very well surprised everyone vs Foreman. Oscar knew to cover up very well vs Frazier both times and may have very well done the same with big George...and Oscar did have superior stamina.

 

Bonavena was cleverer than Chuvalo..he had a surprise reverse gear Plan B.

 

he also told chuvalo he'd meet him head on,in fact he did a lot of running in that fight that chuvalo wasn't prepared for.after chuvalo called him a dog ,he had to intention of fighting chuvalo head on.

 

The end result, a W, justified the means for Ringo.

Likewise, I don't think Foreman could be prepared for whatever Bonavena was going to do, whereas Oscar would know exactly what tactics to expect of the American. You have articulated again what a startling number of posters here don't realize, that Ringo could run if he chose, or stand his ground and take Ali off his toes (in sharp contrast to how Muhammad danced in his previous comeback bout).

Ali said before Kinshasa that he was going to "Dance, dance, dance!" If Bonavena similarly prevailed by swerving Chuvalo, all credit to Ringo.

Leroy Caldwell said the power of Lyle and Foreman were about the same. Oscar stayed the 12 round limit on his feet with Big Ron, and at altitude in Denver. Chuvalo suggests he could have coped with Foreman's physical strength as well.

Did we forget to mention that he beat up taller foes like Middleton, Ramos (in a single round, four months before Pulgarcito drew with the undefeated Stander in Omaha), dealt with Blue Lewis (in Ringo's return from Ali) took the rematch with Folley, and decked Peralta in their round five of their first bout? (Something Foreman couldn't do to Greg in 20 rounds of action.) Yeah, MadCapMaxie's right, the stare off would be interesting, but it's not as if Oscar never chopped down taller opposition. I have more fun speculating what names Bonavena might have called him. Ali was "a chicken." Would Big George be "the Zombie?" Foreman's intimidation factor in this one would be absolute zero (and Oscar's wiener might be getting warmed up by hookers in his dressing room before he ****s over Big George-sorry, couldn't resist ).

 

boxing illustrated who were ringside said in the review of the fight they thought chuvalo had won 6 rounds to 4,chuvalo had the problem that if he did,'t ko most opponents he didn't get the decision ater the fight.even if he did happen to win.
ithink chuvalo thought oscar was going to punch it out with him,in most fights he wasn't a runner he had to be against chuvalo i guess.

 

Chuvalo didn't exactly fall down towards a supine position because Bonavena was running away.

"Running" is a relative term. Chuvalo once boxed a Galapagos tortoise in his house, with his wife and kids judging, but got shut out because he couldn't catch up to the old geezer. Chuvalo's harder shell was no advantage here.

It does need to be pointed out that Panama Lewis was working the turtle's corner, and may have been sneaking his fighter passion fruit juice in a little black bottle.

 

That's a damned good idea for anybody still following this thread. For good measure, here they are for everybody:

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7U31f2PlLJk[/ame]
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O9TjGCJzNvk[/ame]