Haye and Chisora each fought the wrong Klitschko

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by moneypaysbills, May 15, 2012.


  1. moneypaysbills

    moneypaysbills That's Mr moneypaysbills Full Member

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    This is something that I've been pondering since the Haye-Chisora fight was announced. It's pretty obvious when you weigh up the facts, and noone but the supreme Klitschko nuthuggers (CHEF, Vladimir93) can refute with any actual conviction. To look at it objectively we can break down why Haye-Vitali and Chisora-Wlad would be better matchups. I'm not saying they'd win, but they both would have had a better chance of glory, also as we all know the Klitschko's love to pick up fighters that the other sibling has already fought, so even though these two aren't bums, they could still follow their past patterns.

    Haye-Vitali

    This one is quite obvious, Vitali has two losses in his career, both were to slick black G's, but Haye would only be able to emulate one of these. There will be no TKO6, but haye could certainly make Vitali miss and make him quit. We've seen Chrs Byrd do it, and Haye has the same movement, and the same skill. Vitali has a granite chin, so Chisora's power was ineffective, but with Haye able to make him miss he could attack vitali's weak spot, his heart.

    [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bQJN4QmVT5E[/ame]



    Exhibit one speaks for itself, and gives credence to the fact that they rematch each others fights, hence Wlad-Byrd

    Wlad-Chisora

    This one is also pretty obvious, we all know that Wlad has a shaky chin, CHEF will tell you, Vitali will tell and Stevie Wonder will tell you. Therefore, with Chisora's good chin as proven by some of the Vitali shots that landed, his power and his swarming style. He is always going to have much more joy with Wlad. Put simply Wlad doesn't like pressure, if an in shape Chisora turns up then he could give Wlad some real trouble, and maybe get himself a KO.

    Exhibit 2

    [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NqEANlBbhsA[/ame]



    His style won't win him a UD over such a technically accomplished fighter, but the Klitschko's are like Barcelona, you don't beat them by matching style and boxing perfectly, unless you're Lennox Lewis which Haye and Chisora most certainly aren't. You beat them by exploiting their few but still exisitng weaknesses.

    Also none of that he was green bollocks, it was only his 38th fight against a man he assumed would be a walkover.


    So there you go that's my argument, I'm not saying wither would win or lose, but that they both would've had more joy if the fights had been reversed. Who knows if whoever wins beats Povetkin, we may see one of these fights happen.
     
  2. Ahurath

    Ahurath Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Still his loss against Byrd was what 12 YEARS ago? It's ridicolous to bring something THAT old and think that has anything to do with the present Vitali.

    And who are you to question his heart? He is a professional fighter wich had a horrific injury to his eye wich would potentially injury him for the rest of his career and STILL wanted to continue if that isn't heart I don't know what is.

    Get out of here.
     
  3. moneypaysbills

    moneypaysbills That's Mr moneypaysbills Full Member

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    No, he didn't even object to the doctor putting stitches in against Lewis, that's called quitting by proxy. Furthermore, I didn't mention his heart in the Lewis fight, just the Byrd fight. Also when his boxing career spans 16 years, with lots of it filled with bums, you have to mention the highlight fights, regardless of time it happened. Look at the coverage the Lewis fight still gets today
     
  4. damian38

    damian38 BigDramaShow Full Member

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    it's amazing how some people try to make Haye more than he really is at the cost of a a fighter who's never been behind in a fight, who's never been floored, and dominated every single opponent he has ever faced
     
  5. Jack

    Jack Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    The Klitschko brothers are selective about their opposition. It's rare one fights an opponent who would be easier for the other brother.

    Ask yourself this: Who is Povetkin always linked with? Who was Valuev always linked with? Is it a mere coincidence nobody ever talks about Vitali/Povetkin or Wlad/Valuev?
     
  6. moneypaysbills

    moneypaysbills That's Mr moneypaysbills Full Member

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    So you, believe that Haye has a better chance against Wlad rather than Vitali, because that is what is being put up for debate rather than "Haye beats Vitali" I mentioned several times that I did put either fighter ahead of either klitschko in these propesed fights, please read the full article before commentating
     
  7. locard

    locard Boxing Addict banned

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    Haye could possibly win a decission right now against old Vitali because of the sheer difference in speed, 50/50 fight

    But Chisora has no chance to beat Wlad, assuming Wlad doesn't suffer a shoulder injury during the fight like Vitali did, he'll jab Chisora's head from pillar to post and there's nothing Delboy can do about it, he doesn't have Haye's speed or skill to slip them, and his swarmer style ain't particularly dangerous since his power ain't nothing to write home about. Wlad UD or late stoppage. and perhaps i'm giving too much credit to Chisora's chin, it hasn't been tested against a puncher of Wlad's caliber yet.

    and lol at Lennox being ¨slick and black¨, he was as slick as a statue
     
  8. moneypaysbills

    moneypaysbills That's Mr moneypaysbills Full Member

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    Neither of them wanted a piece of SNV because he was bigger than them. They'd learnt what happens when they fight someone with a longer reach thanks to Lewis
     
  9. moneypaysbills

    moneypaysbills That's Mr moneypaysbills Full Member

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    You'd all have probably said the same thing about a semi-pro golfer, who took the fight on short notice, that Wlad will smack him around. Upsets can happen and I believe Chisora has been sold short by his stupid antics post Vitali fight and before it...
     
  10. Ahurath

    Ahurath Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Yeah and I'm saying that you can't hold a fighter acountable of a fight that happend over a decade ago. Clearly he has showed his heart time and time again every time he steps in to the ring.

    Yes but people who hasn't got over the fight between Vitali and Lennox are sad people that like to dwell in the past. History doesn't deal with what ifs.
     
  11. Cafe

    Cafe Sitzpinkler Full Member

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    I know, probably coincidential though, I agree with you and always thought this way. Chisora would give problems to Wlad, Haye would give problems to (current, wouldn't give any problems to prime) Vitali.
     
  12. moneypaysbills

    moneypaysbills That's Mr moneypaysbills Full Member

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    First of all, he can be held accountable he was there, he was a full grown man and a pretty smart one. He knew the consequences of his actions and what he was doing.

    Also History doesn't deal with what ifs, but there are many people who enjoy discussing and debating alternate history. Places like Forums where people hold discussions, to give a blanket statement such as it's sad to dwell on old fights is just stupid. If we only discussed the current HW division it would be boring as hell and there wouldn't be too much value in these forums
     
  13. moneypaysbills

    moneypaysbills That's Mr moneypaysbills Full Member

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    That's a fair point, I would definitely back prime Vitali but we're looking at today's Vitali as in the one Chisora fought, so it's fair to say the Hayemaker would give him problems

    :think:think
     
  14. knockout artist

    knockout artist Boxing Addict banned

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    Fantastic post Moneypaysbills! You're a credit to this forum, it's great to have posters of your ilk on here. I wholeheartedly agree with your thesis, we've seen Vitali countered and punished against slick defensive counter punchers like Byrd and more recently Solis. If Haye can slip Vitali's jabs, he can land his looping Hayemakers on Vitali's chin, especially as Vitali carries his left hand so low. If Haye can increase his output and find the openings, he can win a decision against Vitali, he did it against the larger Valuev.

    As for Wlad-Chisora, we've seen Wlad struggle under pressure by punchers with head movement, and who apply pressure. Look at his fights with Purrity, Sanders, Brewster, Peter 1. Del Boy's granite chin and relentless pressuring style will no doubt cause him nightmares. Wlad can't fight going backwards, once Del Boy has him backing up (like against Vitali) then it's gonna be a long night for Wlad. As for those boasting about Wlad's power, he hit blown up CW Haye with quite a few right hands and couldn't even put him down.
    Neither Klitschko is like a Joe Calzaghe, who overcame all styles :deal

    Fantastic thread Moneypaysbills, unfortunately when you try and make reasonable and objective points about the Klitschkos, the fanboys will be out in their numbers to try and refute, what is irrefutable.
     
  15. moneypaysbills

    moneypaysbills That's Mr moneypaysbills Full Member

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    At last, some more reasonable discussion, with the unreasonable fanboy arguments, it's nice to see someone stick to the actual topic being discussed. I agree that neither Klitscko is like the Italian Stallion. Come to think of it he fought at LHW, so why didn't the Klitscko's try to blow him up to HW and milk him for a payday. I guess he was just too smart for them to sign a Klitschko slave contract