Question:Why some have Rocky overJack?

Bummy,

What did those guys you talk to think about Marciano and Liston?

 

That example is just the type of thing that amazed me - there didn't seem to be any respite in the clinches with Dempsey and Dempsey didn't seem to need very much of a setup in those situations and he never EVER seemed to just 'accept' clinches they way a lot of fighters do (but then I suppose on the flipside Marciano never sought clinches ever anyway and in the first Ez fight for example fight for example the ref didn't have to seperate them once in 15 rounds!! - he was always looking to take advantage of any shot he could get in and he wouldn't be nice about it either - plus the way Dempsey brutalised people with his punches - I know Marciano had an amazing chin and I rarely even seen Marciano even hurt but I don't know I just think that as a rule in a battle of a punch versus a chin - no matter how great the chin is the punch always still seems to win the day - I mean had Willard really ever been hurt in his career to that point?? But Dempsey smashed him to smithereens? I mean I think Tyson had an amazing chin but he still got badly hurt by the likes of Holy who wasnt a massive puncher? It's probably easier for me to 'envision' Dempsey being more hurt (and more easily hurt) because I have actually witmessed him badly hurt on film but at same time I think of when Denpsey had his legs buckled by a tremendous left and right from Carp what would've happened if say he was nailed by a right hand shot like the one Marciano blew Walcott away with?? So many things in my head about this fight - but at the very least this is not going to be a walk in the park for either man

 

Plain and simple Jack did everything better than Rocky in my book.
Rocky comes to fight just like Jack. That falls into Jacks hands. Jack by KO or TKO.

 

At least you're consistent here, Burt. What's your take on Tyson in general? Speaking in terms of what he was from 1985-91 over 42 fights.

 

NO question about it. There are some things that you can question about Dempsey but his power wasnt one of them. He was explosive. More explosive than Rocky.

 

Well they were stuck in their time a bit because they put fighters like Jack Johnson and Jim Jeffries ahead of fighters like Marciano and Ali. They thought a lot of Marciano, Nat rated him in the top 10 ATG heavyweight I believe at 9 or 10 and Marciano retired in 1955 so we are talking about the early 70's that was impressive for them because a lot of there top 10 was the Jeffries-Johnson-Fitz-Corbett-Langford-era.

Trying to remember but Not much was said about Liston they were not so impressed with Ali at that time and they felt Liston was KO'd by Ali and they inferred that it was a fix and on the other hand a johnson punch anchor punch. I think they had a cast of Liston's hands on display but Primo's fist was incredibly Large....it was a long time ago Suzie and I was curious about guys like Ketchel and Greb and Kid McCoy, Langford and Dempsey (who everyone thought was electric) a lot of other names of fighters I forget...I used to go to the 28th st. gym but stopped by ring magazine was about 4 city blocks from the gym...I was a young teen and amazed with the sport

 

good analogy Burt :good I agree a lot of similarity but Dempsey was tougher internally and a wee bit meaner...Tyson acted meaner than he was Dempsey was mean

 

I would say Tyson had better, more educated wheels.

And he fought guys who would have mad Dempsey **** his pants before he even got near the ring.

Seriously, Ruddock versus Dempsey. Are really going to tell me Slacker Jack lasts more than 4 rounds?

 

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Pinklon Thomas would've reigned from 1905-29.


I'll never forget that.

 

The thing that has always slighly unsettled me with Dempsey's performance against Willard, is that beyond the wanton destruction he cause upon Willard, he actually couldn't keep him down.
I seem to remember Willard landing a nice uppercut on Dempsey in the 3rd, before he could no longer continue.
No doubt about the physical abuse he took of course, but with no neutral corner rule, smaller gloves than today's...Willard did not stay down. Just saying.

On the other hand, with today's three knockdown rule (In some cases) that fight would have ended in the first round under modern rules. It's still intersting to note though.