Prime Calzaghe is a H2H Beast

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by emallini, Jul 13, 2012.

  1. Loudon

    Loudon Loyal Member Full Member

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    Bailey, Hatton was desperate for the fight.

    Why do you think Ricky said what he did?

    He tried to embarrass him on live PPV, to get a reaction out of him.

    It worked perfectly. Floyd saw the fight at home, and he was enraged! He immediately got on the phone and called Leonard Ellerbe to make the fight.

    Ricky goaded him into a fight.

    He built up a fanbase in the U.S.,

    he beat a common opponent,

    he then flew back to the U.S. and moved upto 147 for the first time in his career.

    He fought in his Country, at his weight class.

    That is what constitutes has chasing a fight.

    Joe never did any of the above.

    Regards, Loudon.
     
  2. bailey

    bailey Loyal Member Full Member

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    Please answer my questions from my previous post to you.

    I cant go through old posts at moment as searching has been disabled, but there was a great answer about Jones I would have brought up.
    Roy had suffered 2 crushing defeats, but you fail to mention after those he had come back and taken the champ the distance in a tough fight and had, had 3 comeback wins.
    Was Duran considered shot when Hearns KOd him in 2?
    Tell me what top fighters at LHW believing they could beat Jones had Jones fought? I wonder if it was down to levels he was facing because he looked very good beating shot injured Lacy and beating Sheika in 5 rounds who gave world rated Diaconu a tough time after that.
    Calzaghe was only around 3 years younger than Roy, shot himself and with brittle hands

    You couldnt tell me what the difference was with Roy in his fight with Hall where he failed a test and his fight with Calzaghe.

    The difference you could see was the opponent
     
  3. bailey

    bailey Loyal Member Full Member

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  4. Koman600

    Koman600 Guest

    prime roy has faster hands, more power and just overall better then prime calzaghe
     
  5. Loudon

    Loudon Loyal Member Full Member

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    Hi!

    I'll be more than happy to respond to your earlier post. It wasn't posted at the time I wrote this one up.

    I'll reply to this one first.

    As I say, shot is a bad word to use. Let's just agree, that both fighters were past their best, and the fight was pretty pointless. Joe said so himself in 2006, but then cashed out 2 years later.

    Yes he looked good in beating Sheika and Lacy in 2009, but he didn't look particularly good against Tito who weighed 172, who hadn't fought for over three years early 2008. He also didn't look great in 2006 and 2007 against Amaju and Hanshaw.

    You can't tell the difference between a 31 year old, near peak version of Roy, and a near 40 year old version of him?

    REALLY??

    Regards, Loudon.
     
  6. Loudon

    Loudon Loyal Member Full Member

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  7. Loudon

    Loudon Loyal Member Full Member

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    Bailey,

    Of course it was a weak division. It had Ottke, Reid, Woodhall, Veit in it etc. I'm not saying they weren't good fighters, but it was hardly a strong thriving division full of big name fighters was it?

    Why wait 9 years to unify, and starve yourself, when you can easily make 175 and fight better fighters, in a better division, for more money?

    What bigger fights am I referring too?

    Roy, Johnson, Griffin, Toney, Tarver, were all bigger named, bigger money fights, if he'd have moved up sooner. He could have targetted some of them.

    We've all heard Joe mention the crown jewels, i'm sure Zod will put it up, if you really want to see it.

    Sciaca and Mundine etc, were they fantastic wins? Nobody knew who Kessler was going into the fight with Joe. That was Joe's career defining fight!

    I'm not impressed by Ward beating Kessler, no, because Kessler is a very good, but not great fighter in my opinion.

    Again, Vanderpool? Pemberton? Are they really great wins? I don't think so.

    Johnson had lost patience with Joe messing him around!

    Joe's son was in tears watching Roy at his best, and Joe reassured him numerous times, that Roy couldn't fight like that anymore.

    I'm not sure why you've typed all of the Hopkins vs Calzaghe stuff up?

    I said he won a close disputed decision, and he did.

    If it was that clear cut, why was it a split in the first place?

    Where does all of this new weight stuff come from?

    The 175 weight suited Joe down to the ground. He'd spent the last few fights at 168 starving himself, and killing himself in the welsh mountains for weeks.

    He made 175 a lot more comfortable than 168, and he had much better camps. Those extra 7 pounds made a massive difference to him. How many 175 fights had Hopkins had at the time? You make it sound as though Joe had to find his feet fighting in a new weight class, when he was more than happy doing so. He said himself he felt fitter and stronger because he wasn't as drained as before. Hopkins wasn't a big huge guy, so he wasn't at a disadvantage, he was actually at an advantage going into the fight at 175. Again, he was also at an advantage going into his fight with Roy at 175, because he'd had another good camp. I'm not saying he had an advantage over Roy, I'm saying he was in better condition at 175, than what he was at 168.



    Regards, Loudon.
     
  8. Imperial1

    Imperial1 VIP Member Full Member

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    Too bad the Cobra never got a chance to fight Joe would have been a classic ..
     
  9. Kittikasem

    Kittikasem Guest

    By the time Calzaghe fought Hopkins, Hopkins had already dropped two decisions to the merely decent Jermain Taylor purely because Bernard was old and couldn't sustain a fast pace against a younger, fresher opponent for 12 consistent rounds. B-Hop did all the best work in both fights with Taylor, but he got outworked because he couldn't maintain the pace, took some rounds off, and got edged on the cards. This problem didn't afflict him when he fought slower guys who allowed him to fight at his own pace, like Tarver, Pavlik and later Pascal. But when faster, busier guys like Taylor, Calzaghe and Dawson forced the 40+ B-Hop to keep working at a fast pace, his body just couldn't do it. The video evidence does not lie, nor does the facts or the logic. A human being over 40 simply does not possess the same type of stamina as a younger version. Simple.

    If people watch Bernard's fights from the period when his physical side and his skills & experience are at their best point of cross-over (96/97-01/02), he has absolutely no problem whatsoever in fighting at a high pace for 12 consistent rounds. He is superfit, and this allows him to be both aggressive and relentless, even when counterpunching off the back foot. Anyone who has seen Bernard's fights with Glen Johnson, Felix Trinidad, Keith Holmes and the second fight with Antwun Echols (all in the 97-01 golden period for B-Hop) will know he was a far far better all-round fighter then than in the 05-12 period when he dropped workrate-based decisions to Jermain Taylor, Joe Calzaghe and Chad Dawson. Again, the video evidence does not lie, nor do the facts or the logic.

    Joe Calzaghe was a perfect style match-up for Bernard, the 43 year old version simply did not have the stamina nor the power for the task anymore, same as he could not match nor put away Jermain Taylor three years earlier. Calzaghe's lack of head movement, poor guard, aggressive all-action style, and wide punching technique all add up to a fighter absolutely tailor-made for the peak version of Bernard Hopkins. He would find Calzaghe a very easy target for sharp, powerful right hands, and would find Calzaghe's flurries very easy to smother and elude. That fight would be like the first-half of the actual Calzaghe-Hopkins fight times ten, for 12 full rounds. Bernard had more fire and more kick back then, to add to his vastly superior fitness and stamina. He would not only consistently hit but also hurt Joe Calzaghe. In all fairness, this wouldn't be a close fight. The peak middleweight version of Bernard Hopkins was one of the most all-round skilled and effective ring generals of the modern era, only slightly below the absolute elite of the age like Pernell Whitaker and Sugar Ray Leonard (ie: ATG talent level). By comparison, Joe Calzaghe was a good, solid smw champion, far closer to the likes of Dariusz Michalczewski (ie: borderline HOF talent level).

    If people seriously think Calzaghe had the technical skill capable of dealing with a prime Hopkins, I definitely think they have fallen under the spell of the 'zero' record and a fight with a 43 year old man who had shown his stamina/finishing issues over 3 years earlier. Sorry, it would not have been a close fight. Different skill levels entirely. :good
     
  10. BlackBrenny

    BlackBrenny Guest


    prime roids?
     
  11. vnyc

    vnyc Boxing Addict banned Full Member

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    calzaghe was a can crusher.
     
  12. Loudon

    Loudon Loyal Member Full Member

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    Outstanding post, using facts and logic!

    Regards, Loudon.
     
  13. Noneshallpass75

    Noneshallpass75 Active Member Full Member

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    Calzaghe wasnt prime or young at the time he fought hopkins either
    People conveniently forget that :patsch
    It would have been a fitter, harder hitting, no hand problems calzaghe that bhop would have been facing too
     
  14. China_hand_Joe

    China_hand_Joe Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Lets not forget Hopkins was pumped full of PEDs and still couldn't beat Calzaghe, cheating included.
     
  15. Noneshallpass75

    Noneshallpass75 Active Member Full Member

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    The pretending to be injured bits in that fight were laughable :lol: