Klitschkos: B+ heavyweights feasting in the era of C-

Sheikh · Jul 30, 2012

The Predator said: ↑

True. Klitschko brothers are very good sportsmen and not so good boxers. I think this is the worst era ever and to be honest, I really think Haye would beat Wladimir in a rematch. Can´t understand what he did in the fight.
Vitaliand Wladimir can´t be rated as ATG just because they rule the weakest era in history. I am usually very negative when it comes to the Klitschkos and that is because some people write that they are as good as Ali or Tyson or Holmes or Foreman or Frazier etc, etc, etc
They have beaten what´s out there and we have to give them credit for that. But to put them as ATG´s is stupid.
They would not have a chance against the big names, they are not skillfull enough.
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atsch

what on earth makes u think haye would win a rematch? wlad beat him easy and haye fought scared :roll:

Butch Coolidge · Jul 30, 2012

If we could get our collective hands on old issues of various boxing magazines, the Ring or KO for example, we would read that the heavyweight division has been at its all time worse consistently for the past 82 years. Does the phrase "Bum of the Month Club" sound familiar? When hasn't the heavyweight division been populated by crappy talentless fighters? Back in the days when a disrespectful sportswriter would have gotten his teeth knocked out and his Underwood typewriter shoved up his ass by a heavyweight who felt like the sportswriter disrespected him; that's when the heavyweights was a talent-laden division. Back in the days when boxing wasn't a hidden archane sport and a lot more men boxed so they actually had some perspective to it. You don't hear weekend duffers talk about how crappy the PGA tour is and that's because they understand how difficult it is to hit a golf ball accurately for a long distance.

In my opinion, the heavyweight division is better now than it has been in the past. Why do I think such an outragous and inane thought? Because there was a time when some of the best athletes were denied the opportunity of fighting for a professional boxing title, the professional boxing heavyweight title especially, solely on the basis of their race instead of their athletic ability. Does the "color line" sound familiar? Also, there was a time when global politics excluded millions of boxers and other athletes from participating in professional sports of any kind whether it be boxing, ice hockey, football or basketball. Tearing down the Iron Curtain was beneficial for boxing, again more athletes allowed into the professional heavyweight division. Ever think what Muhamad Ali's professional career would have looked like if he had to fight Teofilio Stevenson in MSG for the title? I'll even be so bold to suggest that there were some fighters on the other side of the Iron Curtain who could have beaten the eminent Joe Louis, if Jimmy Braddock could put the Brown Bomber on canvas, there probably was a boxer in the USSR who would have made it for a ten count or more but we will never know for sure because of the Iron Curtain was there. There was a time when the mafia had a great influence on professional boxing. You think Carpo kept his hands off the heavyweight division? Probably not. I'm fairly sure there were fighters who could have been champions if the mob didn't exclude them. Those days may not be entirely over but corruption is nowhere near as bad as what it used to be. And then there were the days when certain boxing promoters stacked the heavyweight division so the financial interests of the promoter were first and foremost, competitive bouts be damned. That's not so much the case anymore.

Instead we have a racially integrated, globalized, less corrupt heavyweight division. And that is worse?

That is the reason I think today's heavyweights, the top ten at least, could hold their own vs any other era of heavyweights you can name. They have the ability to make it to the top in a much larger field of competitors and by larger I mean a greater number of competitors and a greater number of physically larger competitors. I know the old guys are mythical in the greatness but that's just it mythical. Could a Max Baer who lacked two-handed skills make it very high in the rankings against the current top ten? I doubt it.

Basically what it comes down to is we have a bunch of self-annointed experts, who probably never even touched a boxing glove, giving their ignorant criticism of the heavyweight division. Yeah, the heavyweight division is at its all time worst. And you know what? We will be hearing and reading the exact same thing ten years from now and ten years after that, just like it has been going for the past 82 years. Too bad we can't go back to the days of having an unskilled heavyweight knock the teeth out of certain sportswriters and shove their PCs up their collective asses.

keith · Jul 31, 2012

Slyk said: ↑

No, a B level fighter is someone like Ricky Hatton.

Wladimir is an Olympic Gold medal winner and when all is said and done will have dominated the HW division for nearly a decade. A+.

Get mad brittard.
Click to expand...

He still hasn't fought the second best heavyweight in the division for the last decade.

Boxing is not a tag team sport.

Keith

Manning · Jul 31, 2012

Well Haye apparently is an ATG and head to head monster that would beat anybody so this seems unlikely.

Back in the Golden era possible head to head monster Haye wouldn't have made the ring top 10, what with other head to head monsters like Cooper being a regular top 10 fighter.

The Ring ranking's. 1960
Floyd Patterson, Champion
Sonny Liston
Ingemar Johansson
Eddie Machen
Zora Folley
Henry Cooper
Mike DeJohn
Robert Cleroux
Alex Miteff
Dick Richardson
Joe Erskine

1961
Floyd Patterson, Champion
Sonny Liston
Eddie Machen
Zora Folley
Alejandro Lavorante
Robert Cleroux
Ingemar Johansson
Cleveland Williams
Henry Cooper
Cassius Clay
George Logan

1962
Sonny Liston, Champion
Floyd Patterson
Cassius Clay
Doug Jones
Ingemar Johansson
Zora Folley
Cleveland Williams
Robert Cleroux
Billy Daniels
Archie Moore
Henry Cooper

1964
Sonny Liston, Champion
Cassius Clay
Doug Jones
Ernie Terrell
Cleveland Williams
Zora Folley
Eddie Machen
Floyd Patterson
Karl Mildenberger
George Chuvalo
Brian London

1965
Muhammad Ali, Champion
Sonny Liston
Floyd Patterson
Ernie Terrell
Cleveland Williams
George Chuvalo
Zora Folley
Karl Mildenberger
Roger Rischer
Eddie Machen
Doug Jones

1966
Muhammad Ali, Champion
Ernie Terrell
Floyd Patterson
George Chuvalo
Karl Mildenberger
Zora Folley
Amos Lincoln
Thad Spencer
Doug Jones
Hubert Hilton
Brian London

1967
Muhammad Ali, Champion
Ernie Terrell
Zora Folley
Thad Spencer
Floyd Patterson
Karl Mildenberger
Joe Frazier
Oscar Bonavena
George Chuvalo
Johnny Persol
Manuel Ramos

1968
Muhammad Ali, Champion
Joe Frazier
Thad Spencer
Jimmy Ellis
Manuel Ramos
Jerry Quarry
Oscar Bonavena
Floyd Patterson
Hector Eduardo Corletti
Karl Mildenberger
Ernie Terrell

1969
Muhammad Ali, Champion
Joe Frazier
Jimmy Ellis
Oscar Bonavena
George Chuvalo
Sonny Liston
Jerry Quarry
Leotis Martin
Manuel Ramos
Alvin (Blue) Lewis
Floyd Patterson

1970
Joe Frazier, Champion
Muhammad Ali
George Foreman
Oscar Bonavena
Jerry Quarry
Mac Foster
Henry Cooper
George Chuvalo
Sonny Liston
Jose Ibar Urtain
Jose Luis Garcia

1971
Joe Frazier, Champion
Muhammad Ali
Jerry Quarry
George Foreman
Oscar Bonavena
Mac Foster
Jimmy Ellis
Floyd Patterson
Jose Luis Garcia
Jack Bodell
Joe Bugner

1972
Joe Frazier, Champion
Muhammad Ali
George Foreman
Jimmy Ellis
Ron Lyle
Floyd Patterson
Ernie Terrell
Jose Roman
Joe Bugner
Ken Norton
Jose Luis Garcia

1973
George Foreman, Champion
Muhammad Ali
Joe Frazier
Ken Norton
Jerry Quarry
Ron Lyle
Earnie Shavers
Oscar Bonavena
Joe Bugner
Jimmy Ellis
Chuck Wepner

1974
Muhammad Ali, Champion
George Foreman
Joe Frazier
Ron Lyle
Oscar Bonavena
Joe Bugner
Ken Norton
Jerry Quarry
Chuck Wepner
Henry Clark
Larry Middleton

1975
Muhammad Ali, Champion
Ken Norton
Jimmy Young
Joe Frazier
George Foreman
Ron Lyle
Earnie Shavers
Duane Bobick
Joe Bugner
Chuck Wepner
Randy Neumann

1976
Muhammad Ali, Champion
George Foreman
Ken Norton
Jimmy Young
Duane Bobick
Ron Lyle
Larry Holmes
Howard Smith
Johnny Boudreaux
Stan Ward
Joe Bugner

1977
Muhammad Ali, Champion
Ken Norton
Jimmy Young
Larry Holmes
Ron Lyle
Duane Bobick
Earnie Shavers
Kallie Knoetze
Alfredo Evangelista
Leon Spinks
Gerrie Coetzee

1978
Muhammad Ali, Champion
Larry Holmes
Ken Norton
Leon Spinks
Ron Lyle
Jimmy Young
Kallie Knoetze
Alfredo Evangelista
Gerrie Coetzee
Ossie Ocasio
Domingo D'Elia

1979
Larry Holmes
John Tate
Gerrie Coetzee
Mike Weaver
Earnie Shavers
Leroy Jones
Lorenzo Zanon
Alfredo Evangelista
Gerry Cooney
Scott LeDoux

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This content is protected

Blake Rayne · Jul 31, 2012

Phill-Mitchell said: ↑

I wouldn't give the klits **** if their fans just accepted the facts, they are champion of a weak era and the tougher of the two got outfoxed and stopped by a shopworn Lewis, who himself was a fringe atg

The klits are top 20 heavies, on resume not through achievement, not their fault nobody good was around but based on the Lewis fight and wladamir being comprehensively bashed up and blasted out by the semi decent sanders, its obvious that if this was a strong era they would not be dominant, they would be come and go belt holders

Both klits were beaten and stopped by the best name on their cv
Click to expand...

Just **** off. Seriously.

Blake Rayne · Jul 31, 2012

Butch Coolidge said: ↑

If we could get our collective hands on old issues of various boxing magazines, the Ring or KO for example, we would read that the heavyweight division has been at its all time worse consistently for the past 82 years. Does the phrase "Bum of the Month Club" sound familiar? When hasn't the heavyweight division been populated by crappy talentless fighters? Back in the days when a disrespectful sportswriter would have gotten his teeth knocked out and his Underwood typewriter shoved up his ass by a heavyweight who felt like the sportswriter disrespected him; that's when the heavyweights was a talent-laden division. Back in the days when boxing wasn't a hidden archane sport and a lot more men boxed so they actually had some perspective to it. You don't hear weekend duffers talk about how crappy the PGA tour is and that's because they understand how difficult it is to hit a golf ball accurately for a long distance.

In my opinion, the heavyweight division is better now than it has been in the past. Why do I think such an outragous and inane thought? Because there was a time when some of the best athletes were denied the opportunity of fighting for a professional boxing title, the professional boxing heavyweight title especially, solely on the basis of their race instead of their athletic ability. Does the "color line" sound familiar? Also, there was a time when global politics excluded millions of boxers and other athletes from participating in professional sports of any kind whether it be boxing, ice hockey, football or basketball. Tearing down the Iron Curtain was beneficial for boxing, again more athletes allowed into the professional heavyweight division. Ever think what Muhamad Ali's professional career would have looked like if he had to fight Teofilio Stevenson in MSG for the title? I'll even be so bold to suggest that there were some fighters on the other side of the Iron Curtain who could have beaten the eminent Joe Louis, if Jimmy Braddock could put the Brown Bomber on canvas, there probably was a boxer in the USSR who would have made it for a ten count or more but we will never know for sure because of the Iron Curtain was there. There was a time when the mafia had a great influence on professional boxing. You think Carpo kept his hands off the heavyweight division? Probably not. I'm fairly sure there were fighters who could have been champions if the mob didn't exclude them. Those days may not be entirely over but corruption is nowhere near as bad as what it used to be. And then there were the days when certain boxing promoters stacked the heavyweight division so the financial interests of the promoter were first and foremost, competitive bouts be damned. That's not so much the case anymore.

Instead we have a racially integrated, globalized, less corrupt heavyweight division. And that is worse?

That is the reason I think today's heavyweights, the top ten at least, could hold their own vs any other era of heavyweights you can name. They have the ability to make it to the top in a much larger field of competitors and by larger I mean a greater number of competitors and a greater number of physically larger competitors. I know the old guys are mythical in the greatness but that's just it mythical. Could a Max Baer who lacked two-handed skills make it very high in the rankings against the current top ten? I doubt it.

Basically what it comes down to is we have a bunch of self-annointed experts, who probably never even touched a boxing glove, giving their ignorant criticism of the heavyweight division. Yeah, the heavyweight division is at its all time worst. And you know what? We will be hearing and reading the exact same thing ten years from now and ten years after that, just like it has been going for the past 82 years. Too bad we can't go back to the days of having an unskilled heavyweight knock the teeth out of certain sportswriters and shove their PCs up their collective asses.
Click to expand...

Always enjoy your posts of which I read their entirety.

itsa huge bitch · Jul 31, 2012

Butch Coolidge said: ↑

If we could get our collective hands on old issues of various boxing magazines, the Ring or KO for example, we would read that the heavyweight division has been at its all time worse consistently for the past 82 years. Does the phrase "Bum of the Month Club" sound familiar? When hasn't the heavyweight division been populated by crappy talentless fighters? Back in the days when a disrespectful sportswriter would have gotten his teeth knocked out and his Underwood typewriter shoved up his ass by a heavyweight who felt like the sportswriter disrespected him; that's when the heavyweights was a talent-laden division. Back in the days when boxing wasn't a hidden archane sport and a lot more men boxed so they actually had some perspective to it. You don't hear weekend duffers talk about how crappy the PGA tour is and that's because they understand how difficult it is to hit a golf ball accurately for a long distance.

In my opinion, the heavyweight division is better now than it has been in the past. Why do I think such an outragous and inane thought? Because there was a time when some of the best athletes were denied the opportunity of fighting for a professional boxing title, the professional boxing heavyweight title especially, solely on the basis of their race instead of their athletic ability. Does the "color line" sound familiar? Also, there was a time when global politics excluded millions of boxers and other athletes from participating in professional sports of any kind whether it be boxing, ice hockey, football or basketball. Tearing down the Iron Curtain was beneficial for boxing, again more athletes allowed into the professional heavyweight division. Ever think what Muhamad Ali's professional career would have looked like if he had to fight Teofilio Stevenson in MSG for the title? I'll even be so bold to suggest that there were some fighters on the other side of the Iron Curtain who could have beaten the eminent Joe Louis, if Jimmy Braddock could put the Brown Bomber on canvas, there probably was a boxer in the USSR who would have made it for a ten count or more but we will never know for sure because of the Iron Curtain was there. There was a time when the mafia had a great influence on professional boxing. You think Carpo kept his hands off the heavyweight division? Probably not. I'm fairly sure there were fighters who could have been champions if the mob didn't exclude them. Those days may not be entirely over but corruption is nowhere near as bad as what it used to be. And then there were the days when certain boxing promoters stacked the heavyweight division so the financial interests of the promoter were first and foremost, competitive bouts be damned. That's not so much the case anymore.

Instead we have a racially integrated, globalized, less corrupt heavyweight division. And that is worse?

That is the reason I think today's heavyweights, the top ten at least, could hold their own vs any other era of heavyweights you can name. They have the ability to make it to the top in a much larger field of competitors and by larger I mean a greater number of competitors and a greater number of physically larger competitors. I know the old guys are mythical in the greatness but that's just it mythical. Could a Max Baer who lacked two-handed skills make it very high in the rankings against the current top ten? I doubt it.

Basically what it comes down to is we have a bunch of self-annointed experts, who probably never even touched a boxing glove, giving their ignorant criticism of the heavyweight division. Yeah, the heavyweight division is at its all time worst. And you know what? We will be hearing and reading the exact same thing ten years from now and ten years after that, just like it has been going for the past 82 years. Too bad we can't go back to the days of having an unskilled heavyweight knock the teeth out of certain sportswriters and shove their PCs up their collective asses.
Click to expand...

great post..

grouche · Jul 31, 2012

Phill-Mitchell said: ↑

That's basically it isn't it?

Who's wlads best win?

Who's vitali's?

C- guys

And most of the time they aren't even impressive against them, jabbing away, scared stiff until their fat opponent gets tired from walking slowly into incoming jabs and flops on the floor like a fish on the deck of a boat, only to get up fine 30 seconds later
Click to expand...

Bitter brittard

Overhill · Jul 31, 2012

Phill-Mitchell said: ↑

Klitschko fans know their boys are---
Click to expand...

Are you suggesting that we are worse than Brits? :huh

PolishPummler · Jul 31, 2012

No question Haye and Chisora are C - level.

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