Harry Wills

I agree tha Will's chances against anybody couldn't be dismissed without the fight taking place.

 

so new posters can never possibly know anything :nono

right, lets go to cuba for pennies when you can stay in the states and fight for a record purse. yes, thats it. and there is a huge story behind this - dempsey was blocked from fighting wills when he pressed the issue

 

no i was new once, maybe it was just me that knew nothing.

any man in it for the money would take the easier option for higher money. I'm saying Dempsey could have forced the fight if he so desired. same with any fight that fell through in history.

 

its called prizefighting - every single fighter in the history of the sport fights for the money (especially the draw fighters), plain and simple. so why do so many people mistakingly take this as a duck? its simple really - option A) go to cuba or bum**** nowhere and maybe get robbed of your title while getting little compensation, or B) fight for a record purse in your home country

hmm tough choice there, maybe its time to flip a coin

 

and your point is what? all you're doing is repeating what I said.

 

eh you are backtracking now, no need

 

no, like you said, he could have taken the fight in a different location for less money if he wanted to put legacy above his finances. that's pretty much the case with every case of ducking as pretty much everyone here has said

(very few, if any, believe jack was scared of harry)

 

1. We don't know how good Wills was, he could have been an incredible boxer, his resume is the best of the era, he was a viscous body puncher, a brutal uppercut, seemingly hard to hit and strong and powerful. But how good it's hard to say

2. Dempsey ran for the hills, made every excuse going and turned down big money for the fight, if you love him just blame his managers but really it was a blatant duck

 

Yikes I hope not too many people read this cause you will turn them dumber. To everyone reading: this is blatantly wrong and misguided so disregard

 

Perhaps I misread you. But can anyone name me an example of a big time fighter taking the terms in this case? I don't think so, and im sick of people keeping this duck myth going - thats my main point. Dempsey sure as hell wasn't scared of anyone.

 

He chose wealth over legacy. his personal choice but it sucks for us fans of the sport :good

 

Again though; its called PRIZEfighting. Which fighter has not chose to fight for money? The concensus #1 best ever himself (Robinson) fought for money and said it himself. Simple as that. Boxing fans need to think about this one long and hard - every fighter ever fights for money, not necessarily legacy. Sure some want the legacy of course but they wouldn't be sacrificing that legacy itself (the title) by doing stupid moves with it......like going to Cuba to fight for pennies. Thats just ******ed

 

I still don't get your point. We're saying the same thing, he chose money over legacy.

As a prize fighter he wants the lowest risk - highest reward.

As a fan we want the best fighting the best.

As I said, his choice but it sucks for us.

 

I think Dempsey would have overwhelmed Wills had they fought. Wills would have come to fight, no doubt. I think it could have been a barnburner like the Firpo fight and I'm sad it didn't happen. However the race angle just doesn't work here against Dempsey as Jack used the 2nd 3rd & 4th best rated Black Heavyweights in the world as his sparring partners "George Godfrey, Bill Tate, Jamaica Kid" and they all favored him over Wills. The legendary Sam Langford, when asked how Harry Wills (whom he fought 18 times in his career) would do against Jack Dempsey, said in the June 5, 1922, Atlanta Constitution "Well if he ever fights Dempsey my money will be on the present champion. Dempsey is the greatest fighter I have ever seen. He hits twice as hard as Jim Jeffries and is as fast in the ring as James J. Corbett."
A little over the top perhaps but the sentiment was real. Speaking of real - the real culprits over this non-fight are the promoters and if you don't know how much control they had over the sport, the fighters and the money in those times it would behoove you to educate yourself. Dempsey would have still been the man and the fighter he was, but would have been fighting in saloons and mine pits for $2.00 all his life if it had not been for Kearns and Rickard. And he knew it.

Blaming Jack for the Wills fight not coming off isn't rational.

Even Harry Wills himself didn't hold Jack accountable for that - here are two documented sources.

From the Biography of Harry Wills: Wills retired in 1932 and settled down with his wife Sarah, whom he met on a church outing the first weekend he arrived in New York. He wasn't bitter, he said, and as he thought back on it, he never blamed Dempsey for not fighting him. It was Kearns and Rickard, he said, and probably the times.

From the Associated press Dec 22, 1958
Wills fought more than 100 times in a 21 year career that started in 1911 in his home town, New Orleans. But he never did get to fight Dempsey for the title. Once contracts were signed but Dempsey's lawyers forfeited his guarantee and Wills collected the $50,000. Wills said later the Dempsey fight never came off because of the racial issue at the time. "It wasn't Jack's fault," he commented.

The most wronged man in HW history does not hold Jack Dempsey accountable for the wrong done to him - if you do, well, it says much more about you than it does about Mr. Dempsey.

 

You're wrong, there's a ton of evidence showing Dempsey turned down big money to fight Wills. Dempsey-Wills without a doubt was the biggest fight in boxing, it would have be HUGE.

Dempsey turns down 200k to fight Wills

http://news.google.com/newspapers?i...&pg=4296,4114680&dq=harry+wills+dempsey&hl=en

http://news.google.com/newspapers?i...&pg=4296,4114680&dq=harry+wills+dempsey&hl=en

Yet he happily only asked 100k for Greb, why did he turn down twice as much to face Wills?

http://news.google.com/newspapers?i...AJ&pg=2760,402394&dq=harry-greb+dempsey&hl=en

Dempsey constantly made excuses, after Wills took him to court he said 'I'll never let Wills have a shot at the title'. And it never happened

Kearns said Dempsey didn't want Wills

http://news.google.com/newspapers?i...J&pg=5104,3912477&dq=harry-greb+dempsey&hl=en