Relatively (to other greats) fragile fighters that are in the absolute upper tier h2h

Whatever, I agree with whatever you say.

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Lewis ?

 

With Jones we don't know if punch resistance went with age or he'd always be somewhat fragile. A fighter who's suffered a bad KO and brain trauma is typically is 'softened up' and easier to KO

But anyway Hearns is an obvious one, then there's Patterson, Terry Norris

Archie Moore a less obvious one but he was ko'd/stopped 7 times. Willie Pep looked a little weak next to the very strong Saddler and was stopped 6 times

How about Lloyd Marshall, stopped 11 times, similar style to Jones too, although a tad more aggressive

Lewis had a very good chin taking some monster punches. The times he got ko'd he walked into punches with his chin high up in the air. Something most of these guys have in common is they don't tuck their chin, which would protect it

 

Not absolute top tier but has there been a more fragile elite fighter than Wlad Klitschko ?

 

Lewis is hardly "fragile".

I think another one people may mistakenly name is Hearns, but I think his isn't a case for being fragile.

I'll make a case for Norris at 154. I think the only thing holding him back from inclusion in the absolute top bracket at the weight is his fragility. Well, his defensive shortcomings make the chin issue more obvious, but there are top tier fighters with less than top tier defense.

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The question was " relatively " and my answer had a question mark so wasnt a statement of fact, im a huge Lennox fan.

 

Hearns was my first pick, when he got tagged bad his legs looked like cooked spaghetti. I'd also include Lewis, Louis and Wlad in terms of comparing them to other greats.

 

Does Hearns qualify as fragile ? :think

Personally, I always thought his toughness & durability was very good & I definitely wouldn`t call him fragile but the consensus might be different.

Hearns was anybodies nightmare H2H from 147-160.

 

Define absolute upper tier, bud....you mean as relative to their best divisions(ie worthy of debate with ANY fighter there and llikely to be favoured over 90% of the divisions history)or the guys who are likely to appear high up(say top 20 or 30) in a lot P4P head to head list if we forced every one to make one.

a few that could fit in one or the other


Archie"floored 150 times despite my all-time great skill and power" Moore:yep

Tommy Hearns

Lennox Lewis

Joe Louis

Lionel Rose at Bantam

Wilfredo Gomez 118-122

Hilario Zapata and Masao OHHHHHBBBBBBBBAAAAAAAA(mifune voice) for light fly-Fly

Tito at 147-154 maybe

Nunn at 160 maybe

both deeper divisions though.


Incidentally as a slightly related aside, the best h2h fighters i've seen with BOTH a relatively weak chin(just to normal world class levels) and zero power are Zapata, Alfonso Lopez and third leg Kalule.You can count the amount of formidable fighters with both flaws on one hand.

 

1. Patterson was far from upper tier H2H.

2. Pep never showed any fragility problems until after the crash + he had about 240 fights, losing only 11 & he fought for about 26 years as a pro, he has the best win-loss record in boxing history... get him off your list.

3. Lewis is a better choice than Hearns actually, McCall & Rahman sparked Lewis in his prime, the only fighters to stop Hearns in his prime are Leonard & Hagler who are about 654 leagues above McCall & Rahman.

 

Kuniaki Shibata. Not quite at the very top tier but just below it. I guess he might not qualify but hey, he trounced a top 3 ATG/H2H featherweight champ' so he's fair game for me.

Made of wet paper. Balls of steel.

 

1. Patterson was a natural MW/LHW who was world heavyweight champ for 7years, he's certainly elite

2. He still looked fragile against Saddler, maybe he hadn't met anyone who could catch up to him pre Saddler.

3. Lewis took monster punches and walked through them, which is a sign of a good chin. Hearns didn't that I remember. Hearns also got ko'd by Barkley too at what 28? Barkley wasn't 654 leagues above anyone

 

Yeah, Tommy was still around his 'best' when Barkley wasted him IMO.