Real Story on Greb-Flowers I & II/

Shoot, you shoulda seen what it was like a decade or so ago before internet research made it possible to suss out the results of all those ND bouts and get primary sources for his fights! THAT was the vacuum era. Things are much more lucid now.

Have no fear, mon ami. The mists are clearing and Greb and his contemps are slowly emerging from it.

BTW, I liked Paxton's book a lot. Had a lot of great stuff. Some non-primary source mistakes, I felt. But overall it illuminated a lot of the Greb story nicely.

 

Interesting stuff. Didn't Flowers and Greb die not too far apart from dates or at around the same age? Will read more posts from this thread.

Man I wish there was a scientific boxing book that broke down the fighters from 10's-60's with small personal info but huge emphasize on tactics and significant bouts of the great/very good fighters of those times. Then I would like a Vol. 2 with 70s-90s possibly. For now I'll think about getting "Sweet Science..." and look into a few excerpts from there.

 

Thanks ST, Mickey Walker was my dad's favorite pug...He would always talk about Walker to me, and one evening before we entered old MSG, my old man took me into Walkers bar on the corner of 8th ave. And there was
Mickey with his pugnose behind the bar shaking hands with his fans...
I was thrilled to see him...NO ONE EVER TOUGHER THAN the Toy Bulldog..
P.S. I'll look for the bio to come out...

 

Are there any newspapers or first hand accounts of the Jackson vs. Greb sparring session. I would really like to read some reports on that. Let's not try and take away from Flowers accomplishment in beating Greb. To think a black fighter would be given a decision over a Well Known and Respected white fighter what not consistent with the times.. and I believe.. makes it clear Flowers probably deserved the nod.

I'm curious about the Walker vs. Greb street fight.. DId this actually occur?

 

I'm not sure what you mean here. Blacks getting decisions over whites happened all the time and at that point had been happening for decades. Do you have a list of decisions in bouts between well-known black and white fighters in which the black pug was robbed due to race?

No. Those who were with Greb that night all say that they never even saw Walker that night. Klompton's research showed that Walker was holed up in his hotel room all night getting iced down. He was banged up pretty bad. :bbb

 

In their first title fight yes, I believe Tiger deserved the nod. In the second? No way. There is too much evidence supporting the overwhelming contention that Harry got the better of Theo.

 

I don't pretend to know the inside story on these fights, but I have read that Walk Miller was nick named Squawk Miller because of his propensity for scaremongering and disputing decisions,a latter day Lou Duva perhaps?

 

Yup! He just complained about everything and thus garnered his nomme de guerre. Committed suicide not long after Flowers' death:

http://news.google.com/newspapers?id=Bu8aAAAAIBAJ&sjid=OEoEAAAAIBAJ&pg=3723,2398351

 

He's done so much work on it that it's difficult to imagine him not following through. I hope he does. Dying to read it....

 

http://news.google.com/newspapers?id=iYxQAAAAIBAJ&sjid=ryEEAAAAIBAJ&pg=4661,311107

For some reason this writer underplays Miller's "Squawk" label(Maybe he's a relative?). He definitely complained about more than just the Delaney and Walker fights. Still an interesting read.

 

I have always read that Greb won the first fight (this article should be fights 2 & 3) now boxrec has the fight labeled a draw. What gives??

 

Greb won the first.

 

That's what I have read. Does boxrec have a policy on who can alter verdicts? It's listed as a draw now.