Do people really rate Roy Jones win over Bernard Hopkins?

Just look at where they ranked at the time.IBF had Hopkins @ # 1 and Jones @#2 then ask that again.

 

Guys like you love doing research, but the research you read, never takes into account circumstances. It's all there in black and white, but you don't know any background details. You read things in black and white, and come to the conclusion that Roy ducked all of these guys.

The reason why Roy wasn't mixing it with the top guys in the early 90's, is because he was held back by Roy Snr. Roy Snr wrapped him in cotton wool, and wouldn't let him progress to the next level. In 1992, they had a huge bust up, and didn't speak again for a long time. Stan and Fred Levin were Roy's advisors at the time, and they got Roy a few opportunites, for big fights. They then went to Roy Snr, and presented him with the offers. Roy Snr then said he'd discuss them later with Roy in private. Later on, he went back to Fred, and said no, Roy doesn't want them. But he hadn't even mentioned them to Roy Jnr.

It's well documented, and it's on the documentary titled, Beyond the Glory. Roy never found out til years later, that the offers had been made.

Now in 1991, Roy Snr was having Roy fight guys like Lester Yardbrough, at fairgrounds in Pensacola.

It was only when Roy Snr was out of the picture, that the Levin's got Roy a deal with HBO, and he started to establish himself.

In 1992, Roy was not a top three fighter, because he'd hardly fought anyone.

Jorge Castro was a very good win, but the others were nothing spectacular.

Now while Roy was just coming up, and moving in the right direction, guys like Toney were fighting Nunn etc.

The other thing to consider is Roy's weight. After Castro, he was weighing between 160-166. As he was progressing, he was becoming tight at the weight. He was never going to stay at 160 for a lengthy period.

When he fought Hopkins for the vacant belt, it had catapulted him into the spotlight. But because he'd been held back, he'd already missed the great fighters at the weight. After Hopkins, he was weighing as high as 168, apart for Tate.

So you're being harsh saying he ducked those guys at 160. The truth is, he was never in a position to be fighting them.

You can't suddenly go from fighting Lester Yardbrough at a fairground, who had more losses than wins, to then be fighting the likes of Julian Jackson, and Mike McCallum etc.

Again, as I've just mentioned, he wasn't really in a position to be fighting guys of that calibre. He only had 4 fights after Hopkins, and 3 of them were over 160. So you're accusing him of ducking all of these fighters, but your so called research hasn't taken any of this into consideration.

Once again, Roy didn't avoid guys like Jackson. He'd had a slow start to his career, and by the time he fought Bernard, he was too big for the weight.

He fought Chirino in a home coming, keep busy fight, after he easily beat Malinga, who was a very good fighter. After Chirino, he blitzed Thomas Tate in 5 mins, who'd gone 12 rounds with Julian Jackson the year before. He then went on to fight Toney.

As discussed numerous times, the Benn fight became impossible to make, because Don King wanted a three fight option on Roy. Roy wanted a one fight deal only. Don wouldn't back down, and negotiations fizzled out.

Eubank has admitted numerous times, that he was happy fighting at home on Sky, and he never chased the big fights.

Liles was also a Don King fighter.

Nunn was a great fighter in his day, but Roy had embarrassed the guy who'd beaten him.

James Toney at the time Roy fought him,was 26 years old, and considered one of the the best fighters in the world. Roy was an underdog going into the fight. James Toney was considered a better fighter, than the above fighters mentioned.

He fought good ole Danny Garcia 8 months before Toney einstein.

A clearly weight issued Toney? Not according to his manger Jackie Kallen.

Here you go again.

Did your research tell you any of the following,

That Roy Jones at the time, was the best fighter in the world?

That Roy was the unified 175 champ?

That DM only held the WBO mickey mouse belt, that wasn't respected, or recognized by The Ring magazine?

That the judging in Germany in 2001, was disgraceful?

That Roy had been scarred from the Olympics in Seoul?

How about that DM turned down two offers to fight in America?

????

The onus was on DM to go to Roy. Nobody in 2001, expected Roy to fight in Germany.

VARIOUS CIRCUMSTANCES as discussed. They happen in life you know. How old are you? Are you not aware of circumstances yet?

[/quote]

How did Roy avoid McCallum in the early 90's? I've just explained that Roy wasn't in a position to be fighting guys of that calibre pre Hopkins.

Post Hopkins, he moved up because it was hard for him to make 160, and he then fought the guy who'd beaten Nunn. Not a wise decision to make if you're a ducker.

When Roy did fight Mike in 1996, Mike was 39 and past his best.

But Roy didn't choose him to fight. The WBA put both fighters together, to fight for the vacant belt.

Roy beat some very good fighters, that had done good things before they lost to him, and who went onto to do good things after.

A guy that likes to avoid challenges, does not become a 4 weight world champion.

A guy who's scared to death of big punchers, does not go up to 199 pounds, and fight a 230 pound heavy, who'd recently beaten Evander Holyfield, and knocked him down. We know that Ruiz wasn't a big punching heavy, and he didn't have a high knockout ratio. But he was a big punching fighter to someone like Roy, who was used to fighting guys weighing in at 175. A 175 play it safe fighter, that's reluctant, does not get into the ring, with ANY HEAVYWEIGHT! It doesn't matter how good or bad the heavy is, a guy that doesn't want to face a puncher, wouldn't put himself in that position.

Now if you don't agree with that, you've got no respect for the fighters, and you've got no concept of the sport.

You need to go away and do some more research, because you have failed big time here.

Stop looking at things in black and white, and reading up on stats.

Go and watch some fights, and look into fighters backgrounds, before making these ridiculous posts!

Regards, Loudon.

 

Loudon

I saw this interview the other day, thought you'd enjoy reading it, it's with Montell Griffin and he talks about that era between him, Toney, Roy and Darius.

[url]http://www.eastsideboxing.com/weblog/news.php?p=23998&more=1[/url]

 

Legacy investment win

 

Oh my goodness what a schooling.

 

Bailey bashing an american fighter again? What else is new? This guy s4cks up to any none american but mostly with european if its against an american.

 

bailey and most calzaghe fans make no sense really. they put down jones and hopkins over and over again but then say joe is great because he beat both of them. are they good or not?

 

I really don't care if some fans accuse Jones for ducking this guy or that guy... That resume is loaded with good opponents, devastating wins, plenty of titles and all sorts of accomplishments. Roy Is unique and we're not likely to see another of his kind in this lifetime.

 

Thanks a lot mate, I really appreciate that!

 

If jones and hopkins was european, bailey would be s4cking up to both of them.

 

Same could be said about the American Calzaghe haters.

 

I could literally rip apart his 'schooling' in to a billion little pieces if that 'schooling' had to do with bashing Lennox Lewis.

But I'm gonna let Bailey handle guys like him in regards to Calzaghe debates.

Everything he said was bull**** btw, but I'm going to let it go because Roy is getting knocked into 10 minute comas these days.

I will however add one thing. To think that Roy Jones Jr couldn't make ANY OF THE BIG FIGHTS due to 'circumstances' and 'bad luck' ... :think:think:think

is just ignorant.

 

Fantasy Roy Jones never loses in any h2h match ups.

in reality he is on his way to becoming the very first fighter in the history of boxing to get knocked out cold on every single continent..

 

I'm going to use Lennox as an example.

Lennox Lewis didn't fight Riddick Bowe and 90's Tyson. Bowe ducked him on camera. He threw the belt in the trash. 90's Tyson paid him 4 million. That's two guys he missed out on. Two.

Both have legit reasons.

Now imagine Lewis didn't fight:
Mercer,Golota,Ruddock,Tua,Grant,Bruno,Mason,Briggs.
and fought Pepe,Lepe,Churo,and Birerio.

Of course you can find a million excuses for why Lennox didn't fight the likes of Mercer,Golota,Ruddock,Tua, Briggs etc...... but it's still gonna be suspicious and a black mark on his resume.

The thing is Lewis did fight them all.


You can make a million excuses on why Roy didn't fight 99% of the top MW-SMW's, you can even use 'H2H Roy SMASHES THEM YES SIR', but that don't change the fact he DIDN'T fight them....


Roy Jones Jr and Vitali Klithscko literally have their ****ing pathetic legacies enhanced due to 'h2h' theories.

WELL H2H VITALI IS A MONSTER.
H2H Roy is a monster.



















(another thing Roy and Vitali had in common is they both took steroids)

 

Why didn't Lewis fight Foreman,Holmes,Morrison,Moorer,or a younger Holyfield.