Joe Frazier v Ken Norton 1974/76

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Stevie G, Aug 19, 2009.

  1. Stevie G

    Stevie G Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    The best Heavyweight clash that never happened. Imo,that if this had taken place in '74 or '75 Ken Norton would have kept Frazier at bay with his jab and some intelligent boxing,for the first few rounds. By the time the fight reached the fifth round,though Smokin'Joe's pressure would start to tell. The referee would rescue a brave Norton round about the eighth or ninth. 1976 would be a different story,which would see Norton take it on points. People rightly claim that the Manila fight took a lot out of Muhammad Ali. If possible,it took even more out of Frazier.
     
  2. clark

    clark Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Funny thing, Frazier was nowhere near his best shape for both Foreman fights.
    Frazier could've beat Norton in '76, but at a weight around under 215.
     
  3. OBCboxer

    OBCboxer Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Frazier KO's him both times. Norton didn't match up well with punchers.
     
  4. PetethePrince

    PetethePrince Slick & Redheaded Full Member

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    I'm not going to deny this prediction. However, it's dangerous to simplify the reasoning to the equation as a simple "Nortin didn't deal well with punchers." I pick Frazier too, and probably by KO (74 version not likely 76 one) but that's because Kenny was never a fighter that did well on the back foot and Frazier was the ultimate smother. I just bring up that comment because people say that against Frazier in H2H he does very poor against power punchers. In some cases it's true, and others it gets overestimated. Norton might do better against a boxer puncher. In fact, I think Frazier does better against Norton (In his prime) than a Joe Louis would because of styles. Most may feel outraged by this but Joe was just more economical and somewhat cautious, while ironically being the most killer of a finisher.
     
  5. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

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    I have mentioned that Frazier could have fought Shavers, Norton, and Lyle.

    While Norton's chin was suspect vs, punchers he was not hurt once by Ali, yet Frazier was. Both guys were demolished by Foreman. Frazier did not hit as hard as Foreman, nor was he a fast starter either.

    I think the most likely outcome here is 1-1 with the above dates. Frazier was past his best by 1974. Norton was not.
     
  6. Mr Butt

    Mr Butt Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    frazier i think would stop norton late but it would not surprise me if frazier had to settle for a ud win ,as said frazier would be making norton fight on the back foot wich would at least half norton`s effectiveness as a fighter
     
  7. Titan1

    Titan1 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Frazier's pressure would enable him to win on a late, seventh to eighth round stoppage.
     
  8. Hydraulix

    Hydraulix Left Hook From Hell.. Full Member

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    Yeah, I agree. Any version of Frazier would beat Norton.
     
  9. abraq

    abraq Active Member Full Member

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    Most take it for granted that Frazier would have pushed Norton to the back foot. Yet, Norton was physically strong and possessed enough punching power to keep Frazier at bay some of the time.

    In this fight, I feel that style would be a big factor. Norton's herky jerky style of fighting in fits and bursts would be ill-suited for Frazier's constant pressure style. Frazier punched with nowhere near the same power as Foreman did, though. So an early exit for Norton is not likely. Frazier might be able to close the show in the middle rounds. But if Norton is mentally strong and uses his physical assets, he could go the distance in a losing effort.
     
  10. Hydraulix

    Hydraulix Left Hook From Hell.. Full Member

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    Weren't they sparring partners? I think Joe said that Norton was a sparring partner of his after he knocked out Jimmy Ellis. He said that guys like Norton were fast, and he was used to catching them. Or something along those lines.
     
  11. ironchamp

    ironchamp Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Agreed.
     
  12. ThinBlack

    ThinBlack Boxing Addict banned

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    Joe Frazier would have an easier time of being Ken Norton in 1974, than 1976.But he could suffer an upset loss in 1976, his deterioration was evident.
     
  13. MagnaNasakki

    MagnaNasakki Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I think the faded Joe gets beat up and decisively beaten. He wouldn't be able to drive.

    1974, he probably still has the ability to pressure and land the left hook. We'd find out in a hurry if Norton could hip it, but I suspect not.
     
  14. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

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    Frazier wasn't in shape in his first two title defenses vs weak opposition either.


    Frazier never fought punchers like Liston, Shavers, Norton, Lyle, etc... Any one of them would have enhanced or taken away from his legacy. We'll never know.


    I like Norton here in 1976. 1974 is a toss up for me
     
  15. PowerPuncher

    PowerPuncher Loyal Member Full Member

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    I'd go with Frazier, who by all accounts got by far the better of their sparring and hence everything aside has a crucial psychological advantage. there maybe a gap post Manila where Norton overtakes him though

    Lyle and Norton weren't that big punchers, Ali may well have been a better puncher than either of them, he certainly has the better KO wins. Liston was past it when Frazier moved up to be a major contender. Frazier battered the man who ko'd Shavers in 1 round.

    Yet you, Captain Agenda, constantly allude that he avoided them to elevate your aryan favorites