Do people really rate Roy Jones win over Bernard Hopkins?

I rate Roy's win over Hopkins, the proof is on film, it was a great performance

 

Loudon destroying here!!!Damn.

 

From the surface, it's a easy question to answer. Of course Roy deserves all the credit and it's a huge win. Young Roy beat Young Bernard.

But, if you dig a little deeper I feel that Roy does deserve credit but not to the extend that some have given him. If you watch the Roy Jones of Hopkins days and compare it to the Roy Jones who was dominating a couple years later. There is virtually no difference. Roy always had his amazing reflexes and his ability to set traps,counters. His blinding speed and his sheer athleticism. Roy was a freak of nature and a great great fighter.

Bernard on the other hand against Roy during the early 90's only had his youth, his toughness, and his athleticism. Hopkins became a far more progressed version of himself during his prime MW days later on. He became a wonderful defensive wizard who neutralized your best assets, he still had his power and his speed during his prime MW days but also added a far more elevated level of defensive abilities as compare to the young Bernard Roy fought. A lot of the counters/slip works he was getting caught with in that match, the Hopkins of Trinidad days would never even have gotten close to getting caught with.
In short, Roy didn't really improve that much as a boxer since Hopkins I, Hopkins improved leaps and bounds. I think those facts are undeniable. That being said Roy Jones Jr deserve a LOT OF credit for that win. Just not AS MUCH as some fans like to point out.

I also like to point out how shocking of a great career Bernard has had in comparison to Roy Jones.

Let's take the 43 year old, yes FORTY THREE year old Bernard of the Pavlik fight at 170-175 and put him against the 35ish Roy Jones of Tarver I. I honestly see Bernard winning a 12-0 beat down of the Roy from Tarver I.

Also, if Roy and Bernard had met at 168 in the early 2000's I'm not totally sure Roy would have emerged victories. Both fighters have proven Bernard is a lot more capable of jumping up in weight as compare to Roy going down.

It's too bad there is no Prime Hopkins today in the division's 160-168. I think he will clean house today.

 

A bit off topic, but I feel that a far more interesting match and entertaining one will be the rematch of Calzaghe vs Hopkins.
The first one was a sin to mankind, but after the Pavlik fight Hopkins was rediscovering his stride and against Calzaghe's high work rate I think he would have delivered a much more entertaining rematch.
I feel the Pavlik fight helped Bernard rediscover something within himself and elevate him to a point where even at the age of 46-47 he was able to defeat a Prime top 3 LHW in Pascal.

 

Hey there it's good to see a new account that isn't some ***gots alt. Or if I'm wrong it's good to see an alt not being used for trolling.

I believe that a rematch between the two would have had to have taken place in Wales since Calzaghe now had the title. That being said I believe Calzaghe would have won by a slightly larger margin maybe not being knocked down again. I gave the fight 115-112 Calzaghe if memory serves so I'd score it 116-111. However that's my opinion but even if you had a close Hopkins win Calzaghe in Wales would have gotten a UD IMO. Good post though but Hopkins was in good form when he thought Joe having just beaten Tarver and Wright. Still would've been a good if eye-scarring rematch

 

ConserveWater,

Thanks for your great reply.

I think it would have been close and competitive, but I think Roy's speed would have gotten him the win.

The weight issue with Roy is a sore subject on here, but I think it played a big part. He kept his Ruiz weight on, in the hope of landing the Tyson fight, and when it became clear that it wasn't going to happen, he signed to fight Tarver, and took it off quickly, without any sort of expert advice. He said after the fight, that he never thought it'd be as hard as what it was, and it was the hardest thing he's ever done. I have no reason to doubt him. Many others have done it, without any problems, but everyone is different. I think Roy pre Ruiz, would have beaten Tarver a lot easier, but I think it still would have been a competitive fight.

Fair enough. Like I say, I think it would have been competitve, but there's a world of difference between Pavlik and Roy. I sat up and watched Bernard vs Pavlik, and he was a joy to watch. But Pavlik's style is more suited to Bernard. But I agree it would definitely have been close.

It's a real shame fights like that couldn't get made, but I think Roy at his peak, was just too good to be in a war.

Good point, and Tarver was a good fighter, and I think he'd always have caused Roy a deal of trouble, whenever they'd have met. But like I say, the version of Roy that was in trouble against Tarver, wasn't at his best in my opinion. It's all if's and buts. You're right if Benn or the G Man had have got him in trouble like that, they would have pressured him a lot more, and they could have knocked him out. But I think if they'd have fought Roy when he was peak, I don't think the same opportunites would have occured.


quote]Do I feel a Prime Roy can defeat any version of Benn,Mccellan,Eubank,Jackson,Nunn? Yes I do. But how will Roy react if he was caught with a Nigel or Mccellan or Jackson punch? To say he WILL not be caught against those good fighters is stupid, sooner or later he will be tagged and how will he react to them?[/quote]


I think if he'd have got hit flush, it'd be goodnight. But he was that good in his prime, I don't think he would have got caught. But you never know. I've seen Roy take some pretty good shots in his younger days. He never had a great chin, but it wasn't like it is now. Now he's got no punch resistance at all.

You're right, but he's always struggled against boxers with speed.

That would be a hell of a fight. I'm struggling to see an exact outcome.

Great analysis! I could see that playing out like you've said. Even though Martinez is a southpaw, I think he'd have a much easier time against him, that what he would have done against Ward.

I agree. I remember watching those fights. I haven't seen them for a long time, but I can remember thinking Bernard had just done enough at the time.

I watched that fight, and scored it a draw. Joe certainly landed more shots, but they weren't clean. I think it was Bernard's quality, over Joe's quantity. I think a draw would have been a fair result, although I wouldn't have looked forward to a rematch, it was a horrible fight.

What do you think would of happened had they met a lot earlier?


Great debate!


Regards, Loudon.