Gans vs McGovern

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by brickfists, Oct 24, 2012.


  1. brickfists

    brickfists The Nonpareil Full Member

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    [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AT23JRnvMR4[/ame]


    Having studied McGovern's career intensely and watched the fight footage dozens of times i just cant understand how anybody would think that fight was a fix.

    If Gans did dive, its the bravest dive ever because Terry beat the **** out of him, he must of just said im not going to bother trying to defend or fight back and just allow this murderous puncher to pound on me until i cant take no more Because that's precisely what happened.

    Obviously people then and now thought it was a fix because of irregularities in the betting market as well as the belief that nobody could destroy Gans like that especially not a smaller man he outweighed by as much as ten pounds (other sources say seven) and one he handled quite easily in a four round exhibition bout weeks prior. In fact Gans was such a heavy favourite that he agreed to give the winners end of the purse to McGovern if he couldn't knock him out with in six rounds.

    I cant explain the odd betting of how McGovern went from a big underdog to even money just before the fight other than to speculate that people must of realized Gans wasn't looking to good after struggling mightily to make the agreed upon 133 lb weight limit while Terry looked in fabulous condition.

    But i can certainly explain everything else. Firstly, people put to much into the exhibition bout, just like in sparing whatever happens cant be taken to seriously as exhibition and sparing matches are totally different from real fights especially to an animal like McGovern.

    Secondly, Gans did indeed badly struggle to make weight only doing so at 7pm two hours before the fight, its not beyond the realm of possibility to think that Joe was severely dehydrated and weight drained resulting in his barely having the energy to fend off a marauding, windmilling McGovern.

    Thirdly, maybe people these days just don't understand how awesome Terrible Terry was during his short but brutal reign of terror. It lasted just two years and four months from july 1899 when he beat Johnny Ritchie to November 1901 when he lost to Lightweight legend Young Corbett.

    During this time he annihilated every great fighter from Bantamweight to Lightweight including Pedlar Palmer ko1, George Dixon ko8 & pts6, Eddie Santry ko5, Harry Forbes ko2, Aurelio Herrera ko5, Oscar Gardner ko3 & ko4, Patsey Haley ko1, Frank Erne ko3, Joe Bernstein ko7, and Kid Broad pts6.

    That's an absolutely ridiculous championship run and only comparable to that of a young prime Mike Tyson's reign over the heavyweight division which it often is. Actually, perhaps the only way to fully understand the impact McGovern had on the boxing game is to compare his reign to Tyson's, he really was that sensational, Four those two years he was the most feared fighter on the planet.

    So again i just don't understand how people find it so hard to believe that he destroyed Gans in such shocking fashion, if anybody could it was prime McGovern. I honestly think he simply over whelmed Joe with power and intensity the same as he did all his opponents

    Cheek out my article on Terrible Terry here

    http://www.irish-boxing.com/2012/10/irish-terror-terrible-terry-mcgovern/
     
  2. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    I'd love to believe it's legit.
     
  3. brickfists

    brickfists The Nonpareil Full Member

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    It is legit, if you say it isn't then you might as well say that about all of McGovern's great victories because they all happened exactly like this.

    If you want to believe that Liston took a dive then fair enough but how anybody can watch that video and say Gans dived is beyond me
     
  4. Johnstown

    Johnstown Boxing Addict banned

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    good old Terry..born in my city...
     
  5. jdempsey85

    jdempsey85 Well-Known Member Full Member

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    intresting character mcgovern any good books?
     
  6. Cmoyle

    Cmoyle Active Member Full Member

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    I imagine the fight must have looked a lot different in person, and especially to the third man in the ring, George Siler, who was quoted locally afterward as follows: "If Gans was trying, I don't know much about the game. The few blows he delivered were the weakest ever seen from a man of his known hitting abilities. I was unable to see where McGovern knocked Gans out. I did notice, though, in the final fusillade of blows, that Gans went to the floor on the slightest pretext. The last blow was a glancing swing, partly on the side and partly on the top of Gans's head. For my part, I cannot see how such a blow could have put the man out. Gans, in my mind, never tried in the least."

    The whole affair must have looked very fishy to those present if it was bad enough to cause boxing to be banned in Chicago for a number of years.
     
  7. Senya13

    Senya13 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    McGovern was a 2 to 1 favorite the day before the fight. It was at least even money just before the bout that Gans would not last 6 rounds. Several bettors were walking around the ring before the bout started, offering $500 to $300 that Gans wouldn't last the distance.
     
  8. Seamus

    Seamus Proud Kulak Full Member

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    I always thought this fight looked on up and up. And Gans looks like he takes a lot of abuse. However, the reaction in Chicago was extreme. And considering the times, and that the outcome was cosmetically correct for the times, it must have quite unbelievable in person.
     
  9. brickfists

    brickfists The Nonpareil Full Member

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    Yes i read that quote and Siler was a fantastic referee but i believe its quite possible that Gans wanted to 'try' but just couldn't because (A) he had no energy left after making weight and (B) because McGovern wouldn't let him

    How often have we seen guys getting hit with blows that don't seem to have alot of force and don't knock the opponent out but seem to complete scramble their equilibrium to the point where they cant get their legs under them and seem to lose what ever strength they had ?

    It happens alot that guys get the fight knocked out of them but continue pointlessly for more rounds sustaining further punishment, judging by the fight footage that is exactly what happened. Look at the first KD and how Gans whole body stiffens up before he hits the floor, clearly its not a murderously powerful punch but it seems to land around the ear area which would indeed mess up you're equilibrium and balance
     
  10. Senya13

    Senya13 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Gans weighed 1 1/2 pounds over the agreed limit (133lbs) at 7 PM. He was weighing 134 pounds 48 hours before the bout.
     
  11. brickfists

    brickfists The Nonpareil Full Member

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    Source ?

    According to a next day report in the Chicago Tribune Gans was the heavy favourite up until the last day when the odds shifted dramatically with alot of out of town money going on McGovern
     
  12. brickfists

    brickfists The Nonpareil Full Member

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    Yes,

    'Terrible Terry' the Brooklyn Terror, the life and battles of Terry McGovern by Nat Fleischer

    Excellent read
     
  13. brickfists

    brickfists The Nonpareil Full Member

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    I believe i read that somewhere also, did Gans have to give Terry a portion of his purse as much as half for this ?

    BTW love your blog great for research :good
     
  14. Senya13

    Senya13 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    2 to 1 on McGovern was in New York, according to Dec. 13 edition of NY Evening World (which also reported the stories that the fight was to be a fake, Gans agreeing to lie down). NY Herald and Boston Herald on Dec. 13 printed a wire from Chicago, stating that the odds shifted from even to 3 to 2 and even 2 to 1 in favor of McGovern. Even money or 6 to 5 that McGovern scores a KO. NY Sun on the same day reported prevailing odds of 3 to 1 on McGovern.

    In his next-day report Sandy Griswold (renowned sporting editor of Omaha World-Herald, who was at ringside for the bout) wrote:
    "Before the men entered the ring betting commissioners crowded their way through the vast crowd offering to lay $500 to $300 that Gans would not stay the six rounds. Thousands of dollars were bet on these odds."
    Another writer (who thought Gans quit rather than faked) in St. Louis Republic on Dec. 15 wrote that the betting started at 1 to 2 on McGovern winning by KO, gradually it went to even money, then some New Yorkers, for example, Paddy Sullivan, began looking for bets at the odds of 2 to 1 that Gans is to be knocked out.
     
  15. Senya13

    Senya13 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    They agreed that if McGovern won, they'd not claim the forfeit, but if Gans won, they'd claim half of his (Gans') purse as a forfeit.