Larry Holmes is the greatest HW of all time

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Nipple, Nov 7, 2012.

  1. Brownies

    Brownies Well-Known Member Full Member

    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2010
    Messages:
    2,776
    Likes Received:
    8
    I get your point, but the problem is that you could write a similar paragraph for most HW champs. Getting that crown and holding it against top opposition is one hell of a hard task, which is why there're not a lot of guys with résumés looking like Ali.

    Marciano's got that undefeated record, but you could argue that his best wins were against old guys and that he had troubles against Lastarza.

    Liston had a great run to the title, but he only defended it 3 times and lost it in a bad way against Ali. He only beat Patterson as a champ, a guy he had a great stylistic advantage against.

    Foreman took the title in brutal fashion against Frazier and he sure looked impressive against Norton... However he was supposed to be in his prime when he got KOed by a past prime Ali and thrown to the canvas by the feather-fisted Jimmy Young... He also went life and death with Lyles. I love Foreman, but he had his limitations.

    Jack Johnson is another easy target. The art of Boxing still had to be perfected when he was the champ, so he doesn't rank that high H2H. If I wanted to pick is résumé apart, I could talk about his KD against the MW Ketchel... or ay that his best win was against a guy coming off a 6 years retirement... Some of his others best win being against a 5'6 Langford.

    Dempsey : there are already enough threads on the subject.

    Frazier : KOed against Foreman in his prime. Not the longest résumé out there, so you could say that one BIG win made him great.


    See : I can find holes in most ATG's career even if, in my opinion, all of the cited fighter could be included in anyone's top 5 without too many people crying for madness. Same with Holmes, who's definitly a top 15 HW and who could be anywhere in that top 15.
     
  2. Stevie G

    Stevie G Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2009
    Messages:
    25,183
    Likes Received:
    8,696

    On reflection,Marciano gets a bit of a bum deal regarding his title opposition. Ezzard Charles,Roland La Starza and JJ Walcott (first fight) were classy fighters.
     
  3. SuzieQ49

    SuzieQ49 The Manager Full Member

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2005
    Messages:
    37,077
    Likes Received:
    3,733
    I really have grown respect for Larry Holmes. I think he is easily a top 3 heavyweight of all time.
     
  4. Stevie G

    Stevie G Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2009
    Messages:
    25,183
    Likes Received:
    8,696


    I could easily have him at number three.
     
  5. Brownies

    Brownies Well-Known Member Full Member

    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2010
    Messages:
    2,776
    Likes Received:
    8
    Of all the eras, I find myself watching the 40's and 50's more than the others. Moore, Louis, Walcott, Holman Williams and Charles are really fun to watch. These guys knew how to box.
     
  6. PowerPuncher

    PowerPuncher Loyal Member Full Member

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2004
    Messages:
    42,723
    Likes Received:
    269
    Head to head and ability wise he has a case. Dominance/longevity he has a case. Resume and flashy names he probably doesn't, but in terms of ability, size and skill of his opponents he fought in 1 of the better eras

    Nothing wrong with Holmes at number 1, if Louis has a case why not Holmes?
     
  7. Senor Pepe'

    Senor Pepe' Boxing Junkie banned

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2012
    Messages:
    9,408
    Likes Received:
    48
    The Easton Assassin could be ranked as high as #3, but no lower than #7.

    Very hard to put him ahead of Jack Dempsey or Joe Louis.

    Very high accomplishments.

    The Burt Lancaster of the Heavyweights, quietly Great.
     
  8. SuzieQ49

    SuzieQ49 The Manager Full Member

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2005
    Messages:
    37,077
    Likes Received:
    3,733
    Holmes beat some big, prime, athletic, highly skilled fighters....Tim Witherspoon, Ken Norton, Carl Williams, Michael Spinks(2nd time) and some ferocious punchers like Mike Weaver, Earnie Shavers, Gerry Cooney, Bonecrusher Smith, Ray Mercer
     
  9. bodhi

    bodhi Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2009
    Messages:
    19,229
    Likes Received:
    257
    Disagree. Top10, possibly Top5 but quite a bit removed from the Top2.
     
  10. Bill Butcher

    Bill Butcher Erik`El Terrible`Morales Full Member

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2007
    Messages:
    28,518
    Likes Received:
    82
    After Muhammad Ali & Joe Louis ?... yeah, could be.
     
  11. ron u.k.

    ron u.k. Boxing Addict banned

    Joined:
    Feb 14, 2006
    Messages:
    4,920
    Likes Received:
    12
    Astonishing. While I have no problem with anyone preferring Louis or Holmes over Ali to have Dempsey in your top 2 ahead if Ali really says something. How was Dempsey superior to Ali by way of resume, Head to Head or legacy? And I love Dempsey.
     
  12. Bill Butcher

    Bill Butcher Erik`El Terrible`Morales Full Member

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2007
    Messages:
    28,518
    Likes Received:
    82
    I doubt very much a 38 year old Holmes would have been a prime Ali`s top sparring partner either to be fair.
     
  13. Bill Butcher

    Bill Butcher Erik`El Terrible`Morales Full Member

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2007
    Messages:
    28,518
    Likes Received:
    82
    You`re talking to a guy that dedicates 98% of his time on here digging out interviews, old newspaper clips, quotes etc etc just to discredit Muhammad Ali, any reasoning with him on this matter is a waste of time.
     
  14. Colonel Sanders

    Colonel Sanders Pounchin powar calculateur Full Member

    Joined:
    Sep 13, 2012
    Messages:
    2,372
    Likes Received:
    87
    His staredown may be the greatest. He looks like a ****ing psycho thirsty for blood :lol:
     
  15. D9Garrard

    D9Garrard Active Member Full Member

    Joined:
    Oct 21, 2008
    Messages:
    597
    Likes Received:
    41
    In one way, I agree that Larry Holmes was the "greatest" of all time.

    He was the most emotionally stable and the best businessman of all the great champs. Ali was a mark for himself who ended up a financial and physical mess. Louis couldn't contain his addictions and ended up the same, etc, etc, etc. Holmes maximized his talent, ended up physically intact, never showed any cracks mentally in the ring, and ended up owning almost his whole hometown. Who has a resume like his?