What Was Jackson's Status When he Fought Jeffries?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by mcvey, Dec 17, 2012.


  1. Nightcrawler

    Nightcrawler Boxing Addict Full Member

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    obviously, johnson sounds like he has the more legitimate claim but if jackson didn't lose it, I suppose there's an issue there. I guess that's reflective of my question: the coloured championship has the same pitfalls as any other, as lineage and legitimacy can be questioned here as well.

    how closely, if at all, did the newspapers (admittedly, all white writers) acknowledge the belt and if they did, did they hold champs accountable?
     
  2. Seamus

    Seamus Proud Kulak Full Member

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    February, 10 1898

    "Dark Peter is in the finest fighting trim we've seen since his bouts with Dooley. He moves as a Wallaby upon the grange, fleeting and quick, and punches with the clout of an Croc's tail. He surely will defeat any who rise to challenge, including this Yank Jeffries."
    Mick Dundee, The Western Australian
     
  3. Boilermaker

    Boilermaker Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I dont understand this question. Peter Jackson was dead by 1902, so of course Jack Johnson had a better claim to being the coloured champion, even though Jackson was technically still the lineal champion. Personally, i think that Wlad Klitchsko has a better claim than Gene Tunney as well, although i suppose techinically i am wrong.
     
  4. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member

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    " An attempt at humour?" No Country For Old Men.
     
  5. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member

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    That's that sorted then.:lol:
     
  6. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member

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    Here is a contemporary account of the Jackson /Slavin fight in which Jackson sustained two broken ribs, one of which punctured his lung and is thought to be the precursor of his TB.

    NB There is NO mention of a title fight.


    http://query.nytimes.com/mem/archive-free/pdf?res=F1081FFF3E5C17738DDDA80B94DD405B8285F0D3
     
  7. Boilermaker

    Boilermaker Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    This one has it billed as the world championship.

    http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/art...ckson slavin world championship&searchLimits=

    It is forgotten today, because of John Ls comeback but many people considered Peter Jackson the world championship, as John L had retired (from memory this occurred around about the time of the slavin jackson fight).

    Here is Peter Jackson's opinion on the status going into the fight. One thing generally isnt disputed by anyone - Peter Jackson is a class act and deserved a shot at the world championship.

    http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/art...ckson slavin world championship&searchLimits=
     
  8. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member

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    I can't find any reference to Jackson being regarded as the world champion please produce some examples of these "many people who regarded Jackson as the champion .

    Rightly or wrongly ,after Corbett and Jackson's fight, Corbett was immediately seen as the number one contender for Sullivan's title, with Jackson being relegated I was reading this only last night.
    The consensus was that Jackson was slightly past his best and, that the Corbett fight was a bore snore with little action from either man.


    When Jackson fought Slavin, Sullivan was the reigning world's champion. Jackson fought Slavin in May 1892 ,Sullivan was not dethroned by Corbett until Sept of that year.

    The second link makes no mention of the Slavin /Jackson fight being for any title, neither does the article next to it.
     
  9. Boilermaker

    Boilermaker Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    The second link was just for interest.

    Note the third Article which refers to World champion Peter Jackson defending his crown against goddard

    http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/art...rm=peter jackson world champion&searchLimits=

    http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/art...rm=peter jackson world champion&searchLimits=

    http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/art...rm=peter jackson world champion&searchLimits=

    And of course for the Corbett fight we saw the american champion vs the coloured champion of the world.

    http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/art...rm=peter jackson world champion&searchLimits=

    It is actually quite interesting that Peter Jackson seems to have been considered the Coloured Champion of the world. Whereas Jack Johnson when he was champion was considered the World Champion of the Coloureds. A Subtle yet important difference.

    I think that Jackson's title was more important because he claimed it by not only beating the Champion of the coloureds, but also the champion of England (smith and Slavin), Australia (Lees) Plus he drew with Corbett Champion of America and he was Ducked by Sullivan (who never beat that Australian Champion (any of them) and even struggled with the English champions(MItchell and even Cardiff). Of course, Sullivan was past prime by this time and struggled is probably a strong word. Still, Jackson was universally considered the best (or at least a top 3 fighter) by this time. Johnson, despite what we later found out, was not. It wasnt until he beat Burns and later that he could be considered a world champion.

    Of course by the time Jackson met Jeffries he was a shot fighter, and his claim was similar to Jeffries title he lost to Johnson or even Johnson's world coloured title that he lost to Eddie Lawson.
     
  10. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member

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    Jackson beats Godfrey for the title yet does not defend it for 10 years and you give it more weight than Johnson who defends his title 21 times?:huh Slavin was never champion of England and could never have been so because ,as I explained he was not English ,and therefore was ineligible .

    Slavin and Jackson's fight could reasonably have been advertised as the championship of Australia imo.

    Slavin beating Smith doesn't entitle him to call himself the English Champion, anymore than Langford koing Hague made him the English champ. Canadian born Cardiff never claimed ,or won any titles.

    Mitchell's claims to be heavyweight Champion of England are highly debatable, if you think beating a near 59 years old ,9 years retired Jem Mace means anything then include him as such.

    Corbett defended against Mitchell in order to duck Jackson, whom he would only defend against in Florida. The NSC offered a very big purse for Corbett to defend against Jackson in London, Jackson immediately accepted Corbett did not , not even when Jackson said he could bring a US referee with him.
    The Goddard /Jackson fight was for the Australian heavyweight title and was billed as such.
     
  11. Seamus

    Seamus Proud Kulak Full Member

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    So, this means that Jeffries became the coloured champion, correct? And that Johnson won the championship from Jeffries in 1910.
     
  12. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member

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    Thats it! Jeffries was noted for his huge empathy with sepia hued sluggers.

    "I consider it a very great honour to have won the coloured championship from Peter and ,I will endeavour to defend it as diligently as he has done."

    J. J*****o Jeffries.
     
  13. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. Full Member

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    McVey won't like that. Colored champ and British Empire champion.:lol:
     
  14. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. Full Member

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    ^^^ Mcvey losing face. :hi:
     
  15. Unforgiven

    Unforgiven VIP Member banned Full Member

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    All titles were 'claimed' to begin with.
    I'm no expert on the era but I've read that Jackson was considered champion of the British Empire, or perhaps even touted as world champion within the Empire.