Why is Floyd Pattersons speed never really mentioned

Some do think Floyd is the fastest Heavy ever, but Dokes may match him in combos also.

 

Occasionally it gets mentioned that he was the youngest champion and other-times that he was the first champion to regain the title.
Some people forget that........
Some people rate his wins over Ingo, Jackson, Moore, Bomavena et al.....
He lost to Ali and Liston... ah well....
And some think he beat Quarry, Ellis and Maxim in his other losses...
Oh I do think he had probably the fastest hand speed of a top heavy, Tubbs, Dokes, Ali looked quick to me too.

 

deserves to be forgotten???? Why ?? Utter nonsense.

I'll give him one thing though. To take that beating from Ingo and to come back for a rematch, nevermind the manner of his win, took some balls

 

A weak champion? Perhaps. But a hell of a heavyweight.

 

Ridiculous. People sometimes forget that Floyd was not a natural heavyweight. Nonetheless, he was the best heavyweight in the world for a time, and gave Liston a chance when he didn't have to. If you think those accomplishments deserve to be forgotten, you have very steep criteria.

 

Patterson was champion from 1956 to 1962 (off and on).

He defended against a top 3 contender only three times.

He lost 2 of these fights.

He was knocked down 20 times as champion and knocked out twice- that is a record.

He dodged worthy competition. Zora Folley and Eddie Machen were the 1 or 2 rated contenders for half of Patterson's reign. He wouldn't fight either one of them.

He dodged Liston for 3 years until it became a standing joke.


If you like that, more power to you.

 

Most of the above is correct but needs to be seen in context. As a champ he was over-protected, no argument.
However it is not as bad as portrayed. Before becoming champ he was mixing with the likes of Slade, Maxim and Jackson while still a novice. He beat the favoured Archie Moore to take the crown and beat top-rated Jackson in a rematch. Jackson is seen as nothing now but at the time he was just about the most legit contender, Roy Harris again didn't amount to much but he was unbeaten, shades of some of the Klits recent opponents. London was nothing but he was more viable then than when he fought Ali. Rademacher was a joke, no defense for that one!
Folley and Machen were both worthy and deserving but not the blanket standouts they are portrayed as nowadays. They had a stinker of a draw when they both were primed for a shot, then Zora lost to Cooper and Machen got taken out by Ingo who became the standout contender having already bombed out Cooper. Then the Ingo-Patterson series froze out Sonny but there never was much practical time for Liston until he got his shot, a fair bit of revisionism going on about that time. Floyd did beat Machen later and also beat the likes of Chuvalo. He was a brave fighter with good fundamentals and great speed and decent power. If Patterson should be forgotten, so should Ingo, Moore, Maxim, Bonavena, Ellis, Cooper, Quarry, Jackson, Folley, because he ties them pretty well on h2h and whops most on accomplishment.

 

All of that was the work of Cus D'Amato and his overly protective ways as manager. Floyd himself was willing to fight anyone, which showed by him facing Liston despite D'Amato begging him not to, then even going into a rematch with Liston after the first round KO loss.

When past his prime, Patterson was mixing it up with the likes of Ali, Chuvalo, and Quarry.

 

I've watched several of his fights on youtube against much lesser opposition and quite frankly I just don't see it. Good speed, yes, but in the class of an Ali, you've got to be joking.

 

I think Floyd could have been an ATG cruiser, might be interesting v Holyfield?

 

Did you check if the rounds really lasted 3 minutes, old films have a tendency to be played at the "wrong" speed. (See Charlie Chaplin)

 

Immaterial -- I'm judging his speed relative to the guy he's fighting. Watch any of the Patterson-Ingo fights: if Patterson is one of the fastest heavyweights of all time, Ingo must be in the top 5 because there are numerous exchanges when they throw at the same time and Patterson's punches don't get there first, or if so by only a fraction. Compare that to a young Cassius Clay and you'll see him throw the same time as his opponent and he lands a 3-punch combo before the other guy gets off one.

In fact, it seems clear from the Patterson-Johansson fights that Ingo's right hand is quicker than Patterson's jab.

(And Ingo is just once example: any of Patterson's fights you can see this outside of a few no-hope opponents like Rademacher.)

I'll give Eddie Futch the last word on this. He held court with the press after the Tyson-Spinks weigh-in and was asked about Tyson's speed. He said Tyson had the best hand speed of any heavyweight he had seen outside of possibly Joe Louis or Ali -- and he emphasized possibly. Don't have a link but I was there in AC on a press pass and heard him say it. He did not, notably, mention Patterson.

That doesn't mean Patterson, a beefed-up light heavy, had no hand speed. He was probably considered fast compared to some of his day, but I think the pundits in retrospect attributed the hand speed he had at light heavy to him as a heavy, and the video evidence does not support that viewpoint.

 

Fastest hands up until Michael Dokes.

 

Some really great glimpses of his speed here, which, imo, was the fastest ever for a heavyweight. Keep in mind he was usually really loading up, not throwing for pure speed like Ali and Dokes tended to do.

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