Dempsey's vaunted run to the Title

Seamus, I don't believe you're going to win this one, no matter how much we both wish you would.

Some people...

 

I think this guys right :good you should listen up Seamus

 

his win over gunboat smith was a very good win.

 

Seamus you seem kind of full of ****...i did the same thing you did..went and clicked on box rec, looked at dempseys record. Yes he had some barn storming fights where he destroyed no hoppers..but than you also argue that most of the name fighters were worthless wins as well, because they had lost many recent fights. I looked at the records, all those name fighters had lost close tough fights to other name fighters, and those loses had in almost all cases been close tough fights. Dempsey went in and blew them out of the water. I am not in the mood to go in and start copy and pasting records, but i will do that if need be when i wake up.

 

No reply to Johnstown he makes a great point

 

Look at the early opponents of any heavyweight champion in history and you'll see a very similiar story. Foreman is consistantly ranked above Dempsey in Heavyweight lists, and look at his opponents before winning the title.

You seriously need to get over Dempsey, Seamus the fact you did all that research simply in order to trash on the man is pretty sad.

 

Seamus discounts the barnstormers, and thats fine..although i think knocking out anyone in 10 seconds is impressive..still..we can discount that..but than he discounts the complete destrucation of legitimate contenders because they have loses on there records. Almost everyone, especially back than, had loses....

 

:happy

 

Jack Dempsey was a bad mother****er. The way he destroyed Jess Willard, by gee that guy had power.

 

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from the context of doing what he needed to get a title shot, it was a good smart run with avenged defeats. from the context of 'who has the greatest resume ever', its not dempsey.

seamus's description of 'it was a middling run to the title followed by a middling reign' seems fair. the manner of the victories was impressive and dempsey was imo a better fighter (on film) than you might think from his resume.

 

12 years of "championship level fighting? OK? AGAIN lets see??

2 dodgy fights versus Liston with unsatisfactory ending which left more questions than they answered?

Tippy tapping his way against a past it Floyd who spent most of the fight struggling with a bad back before the ref and the crowd got sick of it?

Being given a body beating by Chuvalo who had lost to Joe Erskine (!!??) - yeah really great fighter there!!? Joe Erskine?? Not to mention Pete Rademacher and veteran leftovers from the 50's Bob Baker and Howard King - shows the championship level must've dropped a little since the 50's there

Henry Cooper who actually dominated the fight (AGAIN) until - what everyone knew would happen - happened and Cooper was stifled by a horrendous cut - yeah Ali really proved himself in that one didn't he

Then embarrassed the title against Brian London - London shouldn't have even been allowed in the same town as a title fight - he wasn't even the top heavy in his own country?

Karl Mildenberger? Fairly average really again took Ali 12 to get him out of there though?? Dick Richardson had stopped him in one before!!!?? haha

Then blitzed a SHOT Cleve - yeah looked amazing - but this was no contest from the start - at no point did this turn into a real fight - not exactly "championship level" stuff IMO

Then pot shotted at a tall thing punching bag (and occassionally fouled him when he was getting frustrated) - again no real "championship level" challenge there

Then Folley who really was a tired old man at that point - even in his better days he managed to get beat by Henry Cooper a good plucky Brit but in reality no threat at "championship level"?

Then when returning HE LOST THE FIRST "CHAMPIONSHIP LEVEL FIGHT HE HAD" against Smokin Joe

Then there was your fat Buster Mathis' and your Jurgen Blins' - yeah "championship level" stuff there again I see

Mixed in were a past it Floyd who was still able to give Ali some moments but again got out of jail on a cut

Then skinny Bob who always ended up losing against the top heavies - very predictable

The superlative Joe Bugner - who really lost to a completely knackered Henry Cooper

THEN ALI LOST AGAIN - TO NORTON - who was practically unknown and was picked as an easy opponent at the time - he been KO'd by Jose Luis Garcia 3 years previous

After rematching him he had another softner against Rudi Lubbers!!! Who went the distance!!??

Then he had a wierd fight with Frazier where the ref kept stopping the action and rounds kept ending early - what??

Then Foreman

Then post Foreman - you had names like Wepner, Bugner, Pierre-Coopman, Dunn, Evangelista, etc - no where near "championship level" stuff

and amongst those gift decisions that he really LOST to Young, Norton and Shavers - and then he topped it off by getting beat by a 7 FIGHT NOVICE in Leon Spinks

YEAH AT LEAST HE HAD 12 YEARS OF CHAMPIONSHIP LEVEL TO PROVE HIS SALT :hi:

 

Overlooking for one second the fact that we don't even have half of Dempsey’s pre title run.

The Fulton win is outstanding. Perhaps the most complete domination of a top contender in the history of the sport.

Miske, Brennan, Morris and Levinsky are all good wins. These fighters were all key players in the heavyweight division at the time, and were all pretty much at their hiatus during Dempsey pre title run. These were essentially the fighters who would have probably held a top 10 ranking, had such rankings been compiled at the time. You would also have to factor in that with the exception of Miske, they were utterly annihilated.

Gunboat Smith, Porky Flynn and Arthur Pelkey were name fighters who were on the slide by then.

In all, I don't think that many heavyweight champions amassed a better resume en route to the title.