The Top 100 Pound for Pound All-Time Greats

Ok but he was also KTFO at those lower divisions. Are you just ignoring his losses completely for the sake of him? You don't see Mayweather dragging up a 38 year old lightweight like Pac did vs Marquez, then being embarassingly outboxed in the process. :-(

Stop acting like Pac is this midget please. He's been cutting HUGE weight since his 130 lb days. He was a welterweight at 130 basically.

 

Floyd is way, way behind.

 

Who is your number 1?

 

There are many, many fighters who have beaten a trio of fighters that brilliant. This is where you and I differ. If he'd retired after the 2nd Marquez fight I'd have him somewhere in the latter stages of the top 100. Wouldn't be within reach of Ike Williams, Alexis Arguello, Jose Napoles, Carlos Ortiz like he is now on my list.

You and I both agreed that Mike Spinks can/should be rated above Pacquiao, I'm sure of it, around December 20....11?? Maybe. I remember it was the night I went go karting I'm sure.

Should Spinks be above Arguello too?

 

Joe Louis.

 

I suppose this paragraph is basically just championing Manny even further, so I have nothing further to add. But yes, Manny did go from fly to welter.

Same thing here.

Oh, I agree with you. It's not quite as astounding as it may look on paper or as some fans might suggest, but it still is astounding by contemporary standards. Even if the weigh-ins are performed a day before, any fighter who can be champion of the world of both the Flyweight division and then later the Welterweight division is obviously extraordinary. It's noteworthy because nobody else has even done it, and that's because it really is that ****in' hard to do.

I'll list Arguello's scalps, you list Manny's;

Marco Antonio Barrera x2
Juan Manuel Marquez x2
Erik Morales x2
Miguel Cotto
Ricky Hatton
Oscar De La Hoya
Shane Mosley
Lehlo Ledwaba
Chatchai Sasakul
Antonio Margarito
Joshua Clottey
David Diaz
Oscar Larios
Jorge Solis

Olivares does appear higher on this list than anyone on Pacquiao's resume, but I think we can safely say that Olivares was past his best, above his best weight, whereas the same cannot be said for the likes of JMM and MAB, who were, well, smack bang in their primes.

 

That's not what happened. JMM was drinking **** before that fight and looked soft. Floyd also came in over the stipulated weight.

Then, completely outfoxed, Marquez knew what changes he needed to make to acclimatise at the weight which was likely to make him the most money.

He hired Memo.

He schooled and then sparked Manny out.

 

You can add Jose Luis Ramirez :good

 

Name 50 fighters who have, Flea. It'd also reinforce your argument more if all 50 of them were 4 weight world champions.

2011? Have you not reevaluated any of your own opinions since then, Flea? How about Donaire/Darchinyan II?

I don't think so, no.

 

Surely if Marquez was this Memo-inspired beast everyone is talking about, he'd have raped Fedchenko far worse than he did yeah?

 

Winning titles in two weights back in the day was as impressive as winning in four today.

 

Yeah, fair point.

 

Mosley was horrid.

As I say, Manny has the few greater wins on there, but some of those guys, Solis and Diaz for instance, were not all that, no better than any of Arguello's (Leonel Hernandez for instance was far better than these guys) and Larios was coming off a ***** flap showing against Vasquez in their rubber match.

Agreed again that Manny has arguably the greater scalps, but in terms of depth he's thin compared to the Explosive Thin Man IMO. In terms of reputation at the time Boza, Limon and Navarette won't be as highly regarded scalps as Manny sparking the lineal light welterweight champion. But in terms of what they brought to the table, I'd say any of those, or at least Bobby Chacon, are as good as that victory, especially considering how good and closely matched those guys went on to show themselves to be. Hatton went onto what? Nothing.

I would say outside of Barrera, Manny's best win is Cotto. I don't give a **** about 145lbs. Cotto isn't 'great', but he's very, very good IMO, even post-Margarito still decent. Manny was stylistic kryptonite for Miguel, but Cotto still went on to good showings afterward and did better with Floyd than he did with Manny.

Also, as I already said Olivares wasn't incredibly by that stage, but Arguello was still learning himself.

 

I agree. Okay McGrain, next up: 500 greatest punchers...

 

This whole thread is the work of crazies.

Upstanding, respectable crazies at that.