What's more likely..Dempsey beating Ali or Rocky beating Foreman ?

Lyle almost did it against Foreman and the ref could have stopped it at least 3 times and raised Lyle's hand, Marciano hit much harder than Lyle and that would be a test for Foreman's chin, also he would be getting hit from odd angles. I know people will say but what big guys of Foreman's quality did Marciano fight and my answer is what puncher of Marciano's quality combined with stamina and work rate did Foreman fight...People say the height difference but if you watch the 5'7 Dwight Quawi both older and Dwight grossly overweight for 5'7 I say but watch the styles and you can see where Foreman got hit a lot...a lot of people think Frazier/Foreman but look at Big foot Martin and Dwight Quawi and remember Marciano had 2 hands and the right hand was the one that Foreman got dropped and stopped by 6 times

Dempsey beating Ali, prime for prime, I would say Dempsey hit as hard as Frazier with the hook and certainly Cooper and banks and Ali had the speed of hand and foot of Tunney but prime for prime could go either way

 

sometimes you have a very good opinion but when you make a statement that "this is this" I think you have a bias against an era ...Walcott was a pin-point puncher, he dropped Louis,Marciano and KO'd Charles...Foreman in his prime fought no one as skilled as him nor did he fight anyone that was known to be a good right hand and left hook puncher as Walcott

I can respect your opinion but IMO Walcott would be a tough test for a prime Foreman who had trouble fighting past the 8th round

 

Walcott fought the last two fights of a 71 fight career, at the ages of 38 and 39, against Marciano. He was at the end of the line and champion by default. The division had come down to his level rather than he, in his late 30's, rose to its peak. He had flashes of utter brilliance (the Charles KO is one of the greatest ever filmed) but major flaws and hiccups in his career. Against the challenger Marciano, he was schooling him, almost had him out of there in the 10th, then tired and slipped up throwing a right hand off the ropes. He was a tired, old fighter. Granted, it was Marciano's job to get him out of there and he did.

In Foreman, we do not have the precision of Walcott but an overwhelming storm of pressure from a large, Herculean heavyweight. I don't think Marciano has a snowball's chance in hell of lasting the initial barrages in order to find a tired Foreman, close the distance and land a KO punch. Maybe a prime Marciano has a sliver of a chance against a younger, much greener Foreman, but in these match-ups I always go prime for prime.

 

Yes, I think the questions are 1) how good was Rocky's chin?, 2) how good is Rocky's defense, especially vs. a monster uppercut, 3) is Rocky strong enough to get and stay inside and maybe gradually tire Foreman, or does Foreman shove Marciano away and compel an early rounds brawl?
The taste/will of the referee may be a big factor, particularly with regard to Foreman shoving off, and whether to pull the plug if a fighter appears in extreme duress.

 

It's near impossible but still more possible than Dempsey beating Ali who had one of the best chins in history and would dance around Dempsey all night.

 

if we swap the opponents around i think the fights would be a little bit more interesting

 

Would you also agree that Rocky has no trouble whatsoever with the older version of Foreman (as some people do, quite ridiculously consider this to be the prime version of George Foreman)

 

I think anyone who lines up in front of an old Foreman and who has very little lateral game has a big problem with George 2.0.

 

No, what? Never said he would. Two respectable posters have already answer Marciano over Foreman in the question anyway. I even didn't.

The one thing people seem to miss is that Marciano was most hurt by cutesy short shots from great counter-punchers. Marciano didn't see either. Moore countered him, and Walcott countered his aggression and caught him on a short shot he didn't see. The idea that Marciano is totally out of a fight against any sort of fighter with bludgeoning puncher is totally unmerited, especially considering precision punching seemed to affect him most. The guy was on his backside for merely 6 seconds and that's the sort of sentiment he gets levered against him for being a come-forward, small HW.

Lastly, does that rule Tyson out against Foreman? Honestly Frazier /= Marciano, and while it's an awful style matchup I think Marciano has at least a better chance against Foreman than Frazier. You're going with Dempsey-Ali I guess. That's fine, I did too (With reservations, though)

You think old Foreman beats Tyson or do you like Tyson's lateral game enough?

 

I think that people are too quick to assume that Foreman beats any come forward heavyweight.

I would expect him to, but I wouldn't in any way regard it as a given.

 

Personaly I think that the older version of Foreman would have lost to most lineal heavyweight champions, including some of the weaker ones.

 

I'll go with Dempsey vs Ali. Try as I might I just can't picture Foreman losing to Marciano. Not the Foreman who bombed both Frazier and Norton into oblivion. Walcott opened up early on Marciano and floored him and that's what I envision Foreman doing as well. The only difference is that George would finish Rocky. Foreman was 6'4" with a 78-80 inch reach and a granite chin....combine that with his power and I think he would be too much for the considerably smaller Marciano who was 5'11" (maybe) and 185lbs with a 67" reach. There comes a point when size does matter and this might be that point. Rocky's only chance would be to survive Foreman's early onslaught and drag George into the later rounds in the hope of wearing the big man out as Rocky had the better stamina. If he can't then it's over in the first few rounds.

 

Well maybe but he beat one of them, the 37yo was allot better than the 45yo too

 

Several things wrong with this post I'm on my phone so I'll keep it brief
-Foreman would NEVER be able to land the shots Walcott did it's not his style nor does he throw short, accurate counter shots
-Foreman was Ko'd by Ali and very nearly by Lyle and Young, I'd rate Marciano a greater puncher than either it's not far fetched that Marciano has the capacity to take Foreman out
-Marciano has a longer history of 1 shotting ranked fighters than any Champ i can recall, Layne, Walcott x2, and Louis
-I've seen all of Marciano's filmed fights multiple times and I don't ever recall him being nearly taken out by anyone. It may have appeared so because Marciano was blinded at the time
-The only clubbing puncher Marciano fouht was Layne who was touted.as the next champ. Layne never hurt Marciano and was completly ruined in he fight

 

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meh...