Re-Imagining Mayweather-Marquez: A Technical Summary (Part 5)

Round 9

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Here Marquez lands a right hand on the inside. But he doesn’t have the energy to stalk anymore, and this is just one of the very flew clean shots he lands this round. At this point none of the shots are really bothering Floyd.

His biggest obstacle this round is really his own uprightness. He took his heaviest shots from Floyd in this round, and he simply cannot get away from that jab. It looks like he injured his hipbone or something, the way he lacks any upper body movement we’re used to seeing and he showed early.

Later:

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The way Marquez tries to counter the right hand continues to interest me. These incidences are few and far between, but because Floyd thrusts forward when he throws it, ducking low to get inside and weave out is a smart way to let the other man help you close the distance instead of chasing him yourself. Again, it’s sad to see these innovations so late in the fight.

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Round 10

In this round Floyd starts out aggressive, and Marquez continues to make me think that committing to countering Floyd would have been much more beneficial.

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As the round goes on, it’s clear that Marquez does worse when just waiting on Floyd, than he does when he feints and baits a shot for a counter. Floyd takes his time strafing him with lead rights, and Marquez looks too tired to press, simply eating the shots and failing to counter them in time. His parrying and waist movement have all but disappeared.
Here, JMM is able to time a right over the left once again. This late in the fight, JMM continues to have success with that punch.

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Round 11

More of the same. Marquez at this point can’t defend, and can’t put forth anything behind a jab. I’m pretty sure Floyd was actually going for the stoppage in this round.

Round 12

Still more of the same. What’s lacking most from Marquez’s arsenal is the movement on the balls of his feet, the rhythmic bending at the waist, and the explosiveness he could carry for 12 rounds in order to lead while using angles and slip punches more often to set up counters. The double jabs he was stepping into earlier that kept the jab to the body at bay a bit as he followed Floyd back with it stopped showing up, and so Floyd’s jab dominated most of the fight anyways.

Marquez then lands a small left hand shot lands while turning as he throws that is not unlike the shot that Marquez landed on Manny in their third fight, using a low jab to the body to trick Manny into shelling up so that he could turn laterally and get the angle for his shot down the middle:

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This is more of what Marquez should have continued to do early more consistently; feint, press, explode, then get out and counter over the top. It would even benefit his stamina to pick his spots and cruise in counter-punch mode while bending his waist as he usually does, and then explode behind a jab.

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In conclusion, it appears that Marquez’s biggest moments of success came when he was able to catch Floyd reaching in and counter him, feint Floyd and throw behind a jab, and use lateral steps to turn Floyd as he planted his feet while ducking his head. The constant upper body movement and swaying lead hand that defines Marquez’s style requires great conditioning and swiftness, and while the first 4 or 5 rounds were rounds in which Marquez was making a good account of himself, by the mid-rounds, he was more static than we’ve ever seen him, showing little head movement unless it was to react to Floyd much too late. Marquez has to string his blend of aggression and counter-punching with the mentality of setting the context, being the one to initiate the traps, etc. Waiting on Floyd is a recipe for disaster, but feinting him and then reacting by stepping back as he reaches to counter or ducking low to sneak in a counter to the body or up top allows Marquez to set up his shots and make Floyd more and more picky about what he decides to throw.

JMM’s biggest obstacle was obviously Floyd’s jab, and the reach with which he was able to employ it. Floyd will have this advantage no matter at what stage they fight, and Marquez needs to prioritize neutralizing it. As mentioned before, following him back with a stiff jab up top, throwing with Floyd as he ducks down, or stepping out of range to make Floyd reach further are all strategies Marquez needs to employ in order to win. Countering while going backwards out of necessity as he was often doing is not an option, he needs to consciously make it an objective. Otherwise, Floyd will pick him apart just as easily. The jab to the body pushes Marquez backwards helplessly out of range, wears down his body, induces him to relax his guard, and sets up the quick left hooks and sharp right hands that reddened Marquez’s face in the later rounds.

Tenacity on the inside is something that I can’t readily see favoring Marquez more at one point over an other; today, Marquez is more explosive and carries his weight well while throwing his power punches. On the other hand, he was much quicker and Floyd would be much less savy on the inside at 130. Glancing right hands were landed in this fight on the inside, but all too often Floyd would just push back and neutralize the range. Feint, close the distance (which even in this fight was not impossible), explode, and step out of range prepared to restart.



Anyways, those are my thoughts and observations in attempting to dissect Mayweather-Marquez and re-configure it into a context which has us see a much more competitive fight.





Discuss :bbb

 

Mods, whatever you do, please don't delete these threads, I spent a lot of time formatting them, have mercy and merge them if the thread traffic is too much. Mods, whatever you do, please don't delete these threads, I spent a lot of time formatting them, have mercy and merge them if the thread traffic is too much.

 

This is good stuff, thanks for taking out the time to do this. I found these comments interesting:

The second comment really stands out because by feinting and baiting for a counter, Marquez is actually...waiting on Floyd, which is what you wrote you didn't want him to do. Confusing isn't it? Marquez probably agrees.

Watching Floyd, you can find tiny windows of countering opportunities for his opponent. 95% of the time, those opportunities are really illusions Floyd places in front of them. It's why they can never fully capitalize on them or end up flummoxed, eating clean hard shots while their punch output drops. That's the conundrum his opponents face and even cats like you and I can confuse ourselves trying to solve that riddle. The true keys to beating Floyd will lie in his opponent's ability to impose their will and control the tempo.

 

Thanks for reading :thumbsup

Well there's a difference between simply reacting, and setting traps with feints, inciting the other guy to react. The latter is much more controllable than the former.

Also, I should have been clearer that "committing to countering" meant circling away from Floyd much more often, inviting him to come forward and chase and lunge.

But you're completely right when you say most of the open windows are illusions. Floyd sets lots of traps with upper body feints, jabs to the body, an outstretched left hand; you can do a lot off of range-finder jab. A lot.

 

The problem with the bolded is that you're asking Marquez to...do exactly what Floyd is doing. Only he does it a lot better. Like his opponents, you keep falling into his trap

 

Hey great read man. Will have to go check other other parts. Bravo! :good

 

I actually think Marquez is the superior defensive ring general, given how he can control the center and Floyd is more likely to get cornered. I doubt he can make Floyd chase him the WHOLE time, but it wouldn't hurt to make him reach and give up his height more purposefully. Only a handful of Floyd's opponents have tried to make him lead and reach, but none of them for sustained periods of time.

In the same sense that backing up a pressure fighter often renders them ineffective, making a natural counter-puncher chase can eliminate some of their most useful tools. Floyd is also really good at coming forward, but not great. Not without reaching or favoring the front foot more than is usually recommended. If Marquez has trouble catching him, he could try to make him chase more often.

Thanks homie :thumbsup

 

Which opponents are you referring to?

 

Cotto

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Judah

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Mitchell also walked him into some big shots as Floyd followed him around the ring.

But like I said, my point was none of his opponents sustained it, and perhaps more should try it.

 

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Well yeah with Judah because he's a southpaw. And Mayweather, like most orthodox fighters, takes the lead against southpaws. So I'm not sure that it was a case of Judah forcing Floyd to lead unless you mean because he's a lefty. Either way, it wasn't very successful. Floyd continued to come forward the whole night and broke Zab down.

 

Great thread man, I need to check out the other parts.....thanks brotha!:good

 

Good point... Mayweather dropped first 2 rounds on 2 cards after getting outlanded 11-5 in power shots in opening 6 minutes. Start of round 3 All Floyd from then on, as he outlanded Judah 153-53 in power shots, including 28-2 in the 9th. Floyd played some “D” as well,

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:deal

Overall, Mayweather landed 205 of 441 (46%) total punches to 89 of 485 (18%) for Zab.

Floyd also landed 158 of 322 (49%) power shots to 64 of 177 (36%) for Judah, who managed to land just 25 of 308 jabs (8%).

 

Floyd is definitely more keen on walking Southpaws down. But anytime he walks a fighter down, like Mosley, or like he attempted to do with Cotto, he leans on his front foot when he throws. It's the reason he was caught off balance lunging in against Judah. And in the few GIFs I posted, lots of times Marquez catches Mayweather coming in and giving up his height. Marquez's defensive lateral movement is leagues above Zab's, he might as well try it.

:thumbsup

 

After studying the technical summaries for the fight, I now have JMM as the clear winner.