Fedor (2003-2005) vs Jones (2011-2013)

Can't make a proper prediction on this fight without seeing how Jones handles being in trouble.

Ridiculous to say that Fedor just walks through him in a round though. Jones has shown exactly zero indication that he has a weak chin or folds under pressure. Fedor was never invincible, he could be taken down and he cut easily. If Jones gets the takedown and starts landing elbows then Fedor would be in huge trouble.

When both fighters are as devastating and as dominant as Jones and Fedor, you can't call it with certainty to be a blowout either way. :bart

:hat

 

Pretty much agree, ignorant to say Fedor would walk in and TKO or submit him like its a done deal, besides we haven't even seen what Jones can do at HW
When you look at what Jones has done at 205 so far..apart from winning the belt in devastating fashion, also has since hammered every other ex champ over the last couple of years while rag dolling some other impressive wrestlers like Hamill and Bader along the way.

 

Just admit it Haggis u really want to say Jones! ....... but you don't want to upset the hardcore Pride boys being very diplomatic about it :yep

 

Yes, because one thing I am consistent on, is worrying about the PRIDE fanboys.

No, I think that a fight like this - with two guys as dominant and freakishly talented and invincible-looking as Jones and Fedor - you can't really say that either of them would walk over the other. :good

:hat

 

Id go for fedor just based on him beating bigger and better fighters so far, jones has looked good but has never fought heavyweight and i feel he might struggle at the higher weight.

 

Jones wouldn't be fighting the much bigger fighters. He'd be fighting Fedor. The fact that Fedor has fought and beaten bigger fighters is pretty much irrelevant as he himself is not particularly big (250 or higher, I mean).

And the weight "disadvantage" that Fedor had throughout most of his career isn't nearly as big an impact as people like to believe. He utilized his speed advantage with perfection and he was able to do so because he himself wasn't as big and relatively slow as his opponents.

To think Fedor would walk through Jones is delusional. We have absolutely no reason at all to think that Jones would be outclassed to the degree that people in this thread are currently trending toward. Jones has shown absolutely no vulnerability while Fedor did pretty much throughout his career.

(Edit: Aside from the Belfort fight where he was in a fairly tight armbar but he himself came back to Americana Vitor and was in no danger whatsoever outside of that moment)

Yes, I am expecting the PrideFC fanboys to unite against this post despite the fact that I myself am a huge fan of Pride but am more inclined to live in reality.

 

I fail to see were i said he would walk through jones, i said i would favour fedor due to his better heavyweight record. Also jones has not fought heavyweight guys so you don;t know how his strength matches up against a guy that has grappled with better and stronger grappler's than jones.

 

Way I see it, if Belfort can nearly sub Jones, then Fedor can take the arm.

 

I didn't say you said he'd walk through Jones. I was replying to the collective delusion a lot of people seem to be under the influence of.

Again, all I was saying is the fact that Fedor has fought bigger guys is basically irrelevant because, for the most part, it is as he himself is not a big guy, which I stated quite clearly. Please re-read what I said again. We also have no reason to think that Fedor would have any notable strength advantage if he would have one at all, which I wouldn't bet on.

 

And if Mark Hunt can almost kimura Fedor then Jones can rip his arm out of his rotator cuff.

MMAth is a sad metric.

 

You quoted my posted so the comment of walking through was implied.
The fact of him fighting bigger and better grappler's is plenty relevant as he is used to it, i see your point about fedor not being that big but id bet that he was stronger than anyone jones has faced so far especially in any kind of clinch or grappling situation.
This is also a peak fedor we are talking about and at that point he was seen as invincible(this might not be the case) so in that sense you have to look past the latter loses and think in 2003-2005 if jones had gone on a run like he has but beaten no heavyweights would anyone think of him even fighting someone like fedor at that point in time? (it seems more relevant now after what has happened but thats not a peak fedor against a lhw)

 

I was merely using your post as a jump off point and intended to make another separate post but didn't feel like it.

I am aware of the time frame for the fighters specified. Let's take a peek at Fedor's record from 2003-2005:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fedor_Emelianenko#Mixed_martial_arts_record


Impressive, of course, but really, the only significant names worthy of note would be Nogueira and Mirko which are clearly fantastic wins. The others, while maybe strong, don't exactly scream technical expertise (yes, I'm talking about Fujita, Coleman and Randleman in the lacking on the technique relative to the elite) and the others are just fodder.

Jones (2011-2013)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jon_Jones_(fighter)

If there was a legitimate MMA Hall of Fame there would be probably 5 of them (eventual) on that list (Rua, Jackson, Machida, Evans (4 if you don't like Evans) and Belfort), all of them Champions and all of them extremely technical in their styles.

Jones completely and utterly dominated every single one of them. Fedor didn't look nearly as impressive despite the fact that his competition level was significantly lower in that 2003-2005 stretch relative to Jones' 2011-2013. But to be fair, probably no one has a stretch like that.

If you want to go based on records, that is heavily in Jones' favor. I'll restate again: we have no good reason whatsoever to think that Jones would be so easily dispatched, if he would at all. We also have no good reason to think that he would be "outmuscled" by Fedor particularly when Jones clearly has the superior technique with respect to wrestling (see: Hamill, Bader and now Sonnen. Bader whom I would think is physically stronger than a whole hell of a lot of heavyweights, for the record. Ask him how much his strength helped as he was getting tossed around and Sonnen isn't exactly a slouch in the wrestling department and not exactly suffering from muscular atrophy.

 

Lets look at this again when jones fought half those guys they were hardly at there peak so its not like he was beating 4 lhw atg when they were top of their game(he might have done it anyway). Fedor beating peak nog and cro cop is better than beating machida at his peak, rashad and a past best rampage and shogun.
Your talk about wrestling is amusing i have no doubt mark coleman and randleman would dominate the guys you mentioned in the context of mma wrestling.

 

Not a chance that Coleman or Randleman would dominate Hamill, Bader or Sonnen with respect to MMA wrestling. Okay, maybe a slight chance but no doubt? Please don't join the delusional ranks.

Rua was the UFC Champion when Jones forced him to tap to strikes. What more would you possibly want from Jones? To build a DeLorian with Doc Brown and fight him circa 2005 in Japan?

Jackson was clearly just outclassed no matter where the fight was and we have no reason to think he was outside of his professional peak other than the fact that he wasn't on a large win streak.

Evans was in his peak for the Jones fight having put together a pretty good streak at the time to challenge Jones for the title.

Machida is the strongest case you've got for non-peakness, if you want to attempt to call it that, as you could argue that since his Rua fights he's been "solved" but even then he was in fantastic shape, technically sharp and been the most perplexing to Jones prior to the elbow that cut Machida and basically ended the fight.

Vitor, again, we have no reason to think he was outside of his physical peak depending on what you want to call his peak (Age 18? 21? 25?). A bit of a silly metric. Technically he was as good as he has ever been and clearly in great physical condition.

So your argument of Jones' opponents being relatively weak compared to Fedor's three big wins is a poor one in retrospect. No one, I repeat, no one has had a run like Jones has and no one has been nearly as dominant except for maybe GSP and Anderson. If there was a fighter, a single fighter in MMA history, who truly has looked unbeatable, it's Jones. Only once in his entire UFC career has he been in any sort of trouble at all (which was quite brief), which he was able to escape out of and dominate and submit the opposing fighter. Fedor, while obviously impressive, can not make that same claim. Not even close. You could say about Fedor, "He finds a way to win," because he did. But you couldn't honestly make the claim that he'd absolutely crush everyone he'd fight because he didn't, he was time and time again put into vulnerable positions that his opponents didn't capitalize on and there have been a few fights where you could argue (valid or not) that he edged out a close decision.

This argument is silly.

 

I don't agree with you in alot of the aspects you are speaking about. You honestly don't think a a guy with the strength and size of coleman backed up with his wrestling would not just overpower those guys, guys significantly smaller and weaker than him.
In regards to your comments about peak guys thats a fact, its not jones fault and they are still great wins but beating guys at the top of there game is better than beating ones on the decline(even if you might have beaten them prime for prime you still haven't)
You talk about these guys putting fedor in vulnerable positions, do you think fedor would have had the same problems if he had faced the fighters jones did?