The Holmes that fought Tyson...

Would've been a great example of "styles make fights", in my opinion.

 

Possible. But it never happened so it is hard to judge.

Which "style" do you see comin' out on top?

 

The thing we should take away from Tyson/Holmes is THE WAY Tyson destroyed the savvy, proud Larry Holmes, which shows what a tremendous force Tyson was in the ring.

Holmes suddenly understood he was in there with a killer and showcased his excellent survival skills and cunning.

But the way Tyson came from way outside with that right hook that marked the beginning of the end, had Larry thrashing about and brutally knocked him out inside of two minutes was never witnessed before or since against the Easton Assassin.

Holmes knows boxing and his subconscious suddenly began to quake en route to the ring at the suddenly alarming prospect of the fighter he had to face.

"Nuthugging" is most definitely not recognizing gifts in the ring when one sees them.

Who else did anything remotely similar to Holmes, before or after 1988? Neither Mercer, nor Holyfield, nor McCall, nor Shavers, nor Snipes, nor Witherspoon, nor anyone else continued to catch Holmes sharp powerpunch after sharp powerpunch. Holmes himself admitted Tyson kept catching him by surprise. Holmes tried everything but absolutely could not escape TWO MINUTES. A true mark of talent.

In the end, Tyson looked much more superior against Holmes than Holmes did against early-Parkinson's-syndrome Ali or Marciano against Louis.

You don't do what Tyson did to Larry Holmes without being a badass.

 

Beautiful post! I agree with everything you put forth. Tyson was an awesome fighter at his best. I never was a big "Tyson fan" per se, but I always acknowledged his abilities in the ring. I think outside the ring the guy was a jerk, but inside the ring he was awesome. Was he the greatest ever? I don't think any fighter could wear that label. All so-called "great" fighters have their strengths and weaknesses.

 

Yes, nobody could devastate the exhumed cadaver of ancient champions coming off two-year retirements like Mike Tyson. Huzzah!

When did Holmes put himself in such a situation before or after 1988? Retired for two years and leaping back into the ring against the heavyweight champion of the world with zero tune-up fights to rekindle his reflexes and timing?

As I noted before, when Holmes started his second career after this fight, he did it the correct, smart way - instead of fighting a champion right off the bat, he fought Doc Anderson. Anderson wasn't a risk to KO Holmes in 4 rounds, which is pretty much the point of fighting him *first* coming off his retirement. Holmes followed that up with 4 more fights in 5 months, all against mediocre journeymen, and THEN he challenged a top contender in Ray Mercer. THEN he got his title shot, the 6th fight of his comeback, not the 1st.

It's almost as if Holmes learned something from his aborted comeback against Tyson and sought to rectify the mistake in starting his second career. Hmmmm.

Well, Holmes took every round against the withered corpse of Ali, while, as I'm mentioned repeatedly, Joe Louis had already established himself as a legitimate contender with an 8 fight winning streak when he met Marciano, making that fight clearly different than a retired Larry Holmes getting up off the couch after two years and jumping back into the ring with the champion of the world. I don't even understand why I should have to repeat this, as the dissimilarities are glaring obvious - Louis' comeback had much more in common with Holmes second career and build towards the Holyfield fight than his ill-advised fight with Tyson, which really has more in common with Jim Jeffries returning to fight Jack Johnson than anything else.

 

:deal

Tyson did have his usual performance and kudos to him, but I agree with Tyson in the post fight interview.

 

Not really sure what you mean by two minutes, if you mean 2 minutes after he got dropped first (what I am more leaning towards), or two minutes into the fight. If you mean that, he lasted till 2:54 of the 4th round.

 

About seven or eight years past.

 

Holmes was still a decent fighter when he took on Tyson but Mike was all wrong for that version of Holmes. Too much speed and power for the ageing Holmes. Mike would've been a handful for a prime Holmes never mind the late thirties version of Holmes. Mike did the right thing against Larry, jump on him fast and put some hurt on him right away and wait for the older fighter's foundation to crumble before administering the coup de grace. If he chose to box Larry and let him get comfortable he might've had more trouble but he didn't and we all saw what happened. Styles make fights and mike's style of fighting was too much for a Holmes who though still good, didn't have the necessary tools at his disposal anymore.

 

:blood

 

The Holmes Tyson beat was after a big lay off, he was worse, he got better again later.
Ali was also worse in his first fight after his exile than in the Frazier fight.

Though stopping Holmes is an achievement on its own

 

Holmes was still a solid fighter when Tyson beat him. It was not a prime Holmes, of course, but it was still a capable version of Holmes. And Holmes was not as inactive as people think; he was training a lot during his semi-retirement and had even fought a few exhibitions during that time. It wasn't like Holmes was just sitting around in his rocking chair drinking beer.
And Holmes' legendary bitterness and arrogance were on display during the lead-up to that fight, with Holmes bad mouthing Tyson and degrading him continually.

 

A fair compromise to the opposing sides of this thread would be to say that in 1988 " Holmes was still as good as the AVERAGE contender, perhaps even a hair better than some. " But to try and manufacture an argument bolstering that he was anywhere near his best or that it was a "legacy building" win for Tyson just doesn't cut it.

 

I was about to say UpWithEvil is the best person on here and then he tried to defend Marciano knocking out Louis. Tyson knocked out a past his prime washed up Holmes and Marciano knocked out a washed up Louis who needed a payday so came out of retirement. Neither one should get credit for what they did.

 

GOOD win for Tyson. Holmes knew a fight with Tyson was in the works as early as 1986. Holmes kept in shape, stayed sharp and had a few exhibitions, knowing a fight with Tyson was on the horizon. Why face unnecessary opposition that won't give you much credence anyways? And as Prime mentioned already, Holmes was a prideful champion and wouldn't take the fight unless he felt ready. He went back into "retirement" knowing that this Tyson kid was set to rule the division for some time. And only when Tyson switched to King and started slipping dramatically, not to mention the route Foreman was taking to a championship fight, did Holmes decide to un-retire and make another go at the championship.

1988 Holmes was still better than the older, fatter, slower version that beat Mercer and troubled Holyfield.