The Holmes that fought Tyson...

I agree. The Holmes that fought Mercer and Holyfield was probably more degraded than the 1988 version of Holmes, regardless of how many tune-up fights the 1991/2 version of Holmes had. Holmes looked slower and more lethargic against Mercer and Holyfield.

 

I think too much stock is being put into the exhibitions. Holmes fought very light in his exhibitions. He sparred harder than he fought exhibitions.

Here he is in 1989 or 1990, over a year after the Tyson fight in an exhibition with Bernardo Mercardo and James Quick Tillis. He was doing exhibitions as recently as 2004 and sparring up until 2006 or so. It doesn't mean he was shaking off ring rust or getting into fighting shape, he just used it as a means to make a quick buck and to keep in regular (not boxing) shape.

[yt]vIYNgdz42P4[/yt]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vIYNgdz42P4

As was mentioned in the video, Holmes wasn't even training here and was actually partying, but he still looks in decent shape.

Holmes may have been slimmer and more athletically capable in 1988 against Tyson, but he was definitely sharper and more intune with his abilities when he fought Mercer and Holyfield.

 

I disagree. How much sharper will the Eddie Gonzales' and Tim Anderson's make Holmes? Especially an older Holmes. In all actuality, he looks sharper against Tyson than he did 4 years later.

 

It's about putting the rounds in under the bright lights and also getting more time in the gym that get rid of the ring rust. Doing light exhibitions and sparring from time to time won't keep the ring rust off.

There's a reason that even the most polished fighters show ring rust if they haven't had a fight in a while but still had a full training camp.

Against Mercer and Holyfield, Holmes was more accurate and his reflexes were more intune with his olderself. He knew how to fight better given his age than he did when he fought Tyson.

 

I think that had more to do with Tyson.

 

The Holmes that fought Tyson seldom got off with punches.

 

1988 holmes was done and he was not trained, he was pathetic in 88-89 against ruddock in the sparring sessions. AN NOT HE WAS NOT BETTER IN 1988 THAN HE WAS IN 1992, because in 1992 he was better trained and more active. in 1988 he did nothing since 1986. tons of fighters would have beaten the version 88 of larry without great problems, he was old, fat, slow and HE WAS NOT TRAINED OR MENTALLY MOTIVATED

 

Mike Tyson and Roy Jones Junior have a similar following because people loved thier styles. I think this fine.

The thing is that those same fighters never accomplished in the ring was their fans have decided they would have accomplished in reality. Tyson was an all-time great fighter. If he never fought Holmes he would have still been great. Even though he was KO'ed straight by Douglas he is still an All-time great.


No one ever speaks to the win Robinson has over Armstrong because it was not the great Armstrong, but just a former great fighter with a name. It would be disrespectful to say this is a great win on Robinson's resume. Now, if this was the only hall-of-famer on Robinson's resume then that would change things when trying to make a case for just how great Robinson was. A fan of Robinson might have to push this issue, add some luster to it, and take it out of context so that Robinson could get a little more credit out of that win then was necessary. Squeezing credit out of this Tyson win makes Tyson look bad. Tyson took care of business. Bottom line. That is probably the best that should be said about this win.

Holmes was at the retirement age, which he was. 38 is not an age to be fighting a prime Mike Tyson. A almost a two year lay-off and getting in he ring at 38 with nothing to prove takes guts and stupidity. If I were the Tyson people I would have been all over making this fight just for that reason. It is a great name on his resume. Holmes made 2 million and retired right after the fight.

From what I have seen of Holmes, which is not much, is that in his prime he would have presented a similar and greater style match up of Buster Douglas. Same height, almost the same reach, yet Holmes had a great chin and master boxing skill and was always in great shape.

If this is a great win for Tyson so be it. For Holmes it didn't do an inch of damage to his already secure legacy.

 

Holmes has said he wasn't ready to fight Tyson but he was offered a truckload of money and caved in. In the same interview he also said he wasn't KO'd by Tyson but heard the Ref say "Stay down son" and thought "Ok". Draw your own conclusions.

 

I think that had more to do with Tyson.

 

Many people, even on these boards, claim Holmes beat Spinks in the rematch. Tyson-Holmes was considered a passing of the guard. Holmes was definitely past prime but he was nowhere near washed up or fighting only for the money. He took the fight thinking he could beat Tyson. But it's the way Holmes got his brains scrambled by a young fighting machine that rings true here. It has NEVER happened before or since, not because Holmes was rusty (which is why fighters spar and fight exhibitions - to get rid of the rust) or ill prepared, but because Tyson was young and hungry and simply had the style to wreck havoc.

 

Holmes, as I pointed out with the video, did not take exhibitions seriously and was sparring as recently as 2006. He was not in his usual fighting shape in 1988 that he was in his later comeback fights.

Sparring for a few months and doing an exhibition or two will not erase the damage from partying and relaxing for 2 years.

It's the mentality of all fighters that they think they can beat anyone. Duran still feels that he can beat Pacquiao in a fight, even today.

Holmes took the Tyson fight for the money. Plain and simple. It's why he took every fight. It was a gamble for him. He loses, then he makes nearly $4 million in a single night after a 2 year layoff. He wins, then he pulled off an enormous upset and set himself up for another mega-payday or two.

I would definitely favor the Holmes of the Mercer and Holyfield fights over the Holmes of the Tyson fight.

 

Nope no no nooooooooope!!!!!!

 

a little off topic but a good little vid of mike and larry recently
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c3dFi_qqe1c

 

holmes says here he doesnt need the money, the lay off did him good and knows what hes getting himself into. do you really think he wouldnt have prepared??
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m861f99Nkvk