Duran and Leonard made ridiculous comments. Like the fab 4 again is untouchable.

I'm with both you guys here.If there's one of the fab 4 that Floyd has a good style for competing with,it's Cholo.
Floyd is a superb inside fighter,and all that stuff on the pads that some people question,added to his superb use of his forearms and elbows,would actually work against Duran IMO.
I'm not saying Floyd wins, but he has the style to sit on the ropes and counter Duran.

 

I think Floyd is one of the best at welter. But this statement is rediculous. He is 50% to blame for the Pacqiou fight not a happening and thus not cementing his legacy.
Lets face it if he fought Manny 2 y or 3 years ago and won, a lot more people would have debated in his claim as the greatest at that weight. But because of his partial refusal to fight Manny he can never claim that legacy now in the eyes of a lot of fans.

 

Floyd is more like 95 percent the blame for the fight happening. It was evident he was going to bring up obstacles to prevent the fight.

 

Leonard ducked Pryor.

 

This I never understood. Why would Leonard who had Duran and Hearns and Benitez to fight, need Pryor? And where would he fight him. No way did Ray duck Pryor. I think he had enough fights and legends to fight. As it is , he fought more legends than most guys do and more upper level legends. Pryor needed Ray, not the other way around. And believe me , as great Alexis was, Ray in his prime and at 147 would not have been a winning fight for Pryor.

 

Ya got that reversed, TR never wanted the fight that is why they walked away the first time.

 

no.. I have seen boxing for years and know what happened. It was easy to see even when Floyd opened his mouth. A fighter of Manny's level is not going to be dictated to, and Floyd knows this. He started to say this is what we need, and he knows a fighter who is great like Manny is not going to have the requirements spelled out by Floyd, especially when Manny was the one who fought everyone and had the resume. Floyd knew that if he lays down the law the fight will not happen. And it didn't. I can tell Manny would have fought him at anytime. I see this in fighters, and we all know the ones who fight everyone and the ones who do not. Floyd handpicks and it is obvious. If he fights everyone, why didn't he fight everyone?

 

Silly comment really, the deal was finalized . . . Manny wanted 10mill/pound and Mayweather wanted his testing protocol . . . both guys were asking for something outside of the box. Floyd agreed and TR made a million and one excuses. Now they agree to the blood testing and wanting the old agreement they walked away from. If they would have agreed to the testing protocol back in 09 the fight would have happened already.

I did not say Manny did not want the fight, it was TR who did not want it, they were the big winners by getting Manny fight in house and double dipping they made as much if not more that the Mayweather fight.

I like Manny and if he were so proud he would never agree to less money now or the request the same drug testing against Rios. I do not think it was pride rather bad advice, he should have done like other fighters (Holyfield) who were confronted by such allegations . . . roll up his sleeve. By not doing this and going to court, he looked weak. It also raises suspicion, I dont think he was on anything but I can see why people do.

what you are suggesting is that not only could Mayweather read Manny's mind but you can as well. Personally, I do not believe in clairvoyance, and if that is what you are basing your argument on I think you should go back and re-assess your position

 

Floyd handpicking his fights now shows how he wants everything his way, even the quality of his opponents. Do you really think anyone believes that Manny didn't want the fight? Come on. Manny is a warrior who fights everyone. Floyd has the skills to beat Manny, but not the inner confidence. I do believe something about Manny scared Floyd. Something about his fighting spirit. He saw something in Manny which if the fight got tough, he didn't know if he could go as deep as Manny did. That is what I think this about.

 

Overall I agree with the sentiments expressed in your post and the ones quoted, Floyd is too savvy to get stopped IMO. Viruet seemed more keen on pumping out the jab on the move than Floyd, but Floyd's footwork is very efficient and his ability to roll or smother punches is excellent.

But against the ropes, while Floyd will do well defensively, he will be a bit crippled offensively. The best inside fighters I've seen, which include Chavez and Duran, are masters at taking their left forearm and pressing it against an opponent's right arm, neutralizing the right hand. Floyd's left arm will already be a bit smothered by Duran's body weight, so he'd have to try to push off with the forearm, but Duran would be the one controlling when that position is broken. Also Duran particularly has shown good use of angles when pressing a fighter against the ropes; feinting, then switching to one side and then the other to attack the body. It would be a very tough fight for Floyd. With his reach and speed and reflexes, he'd trouble Duran on the outside, but where Duran fails at cutting off the ring, he excels at countering his way in from out of range and rushing a fighter back when they are inopportunely off balance. It's then that Duran will be able to unleash the beast within.

 

J,

You don't have to be a mind reader to see that Manny was backed into a corner and put into a defensive mindset. Manny wasn't going to be dictated to, and he agreed straight away to the blood tests, but not with cut off dates.

Now if Manny agreed to be OSDT'd in the first place, then why couldn't Floyd meet him half way and give him the cut off that he wanted?

In the other thread regarding this whole mess, Sweet Jones put some links up with quotes from Victor Conte, and Dr Don Catlin. Now if you read their theories, Manny could not have cheated with a 14 day cut off, or a 24 day cut off, with an after fight blood test. It wasn't possible. That means there was NO reason why Manny HAD to be tested randomly up to the day of the fight. It wasn't necessary. Cut offs of 14 and 24 days, were more than sufficient.

I respect you as a poster, but I can't for the life of me see how you don't hold Floyd responsible in anyway?

It baffles me.

 

You know fine well I'll take that insight on board and I wouldn't even attempt to try and better your reasons for disagreeing with me Bogo.
But I see exactly what you mean about his offence being shut down,but when I've watched Floyd against the ropes I'm always thinking of how he'd do with Chavez and Duran.
Now granted,he hasn't fought anyone close to these guys style and ability wise(prime) I do think he's the guy who's best equipped to at least make a dent in their attacks on the ropes.

And for Jasper and MAG.Even though you're disagreeing, it's good to see measured and readable debating guys.:good

Now I'm gonna post this and you'll be calling each other "***gits" and threatening to **** each other's mama!atsch

 

Duran was also at his peak, physically, and mentally at 135, and a far better fighter than he ever was at the higher weights.

 

yes he was, although I don't think he was as bad at 147 and 154 as people say. I just think he lost to Hearns,Benitez and Leonard at those weights and the excuses started to come in. To say a many is so much better a lower weight is fine, but if he actually stepped up his competition when he moved up then it would be hard to tell. Losing would also make him lose confidence and fight differently. People give Duran credit for Palomino and Leonard one, but when he lost somehow he was old and too heavy in weight. But I do believe in the fact that Floyd would never fight Duran or any of the other fab 4.

 

Good post.

I'm certain that Floyd wouldn't have fought Ray, Tommy or Duran.

I'll give him a pass for Marvin though, as he was obviously too big.

I think all of them would have intimidated him, but Tommy would have terrified him.