Does anyone believe Fraziers greatness took a hit with his losses to Foreman?

:roll:

 

You were blessed to have a very astute Grandfather.

:good

 

So, getting smashed around like a rag doll and dumped on your arse six times in a few minutes is showing a 'great chin' now. :!::!:

 

Of course, Floyd showed the same against Ingo, why would you doubt it?:huh

 

I'm not saying you're wrong about Frazier. I mean, there's no consensus definition of "greatness", so I can't say you're wrong. But I think yours is an unusual way of looking at it.

Are you saying Ali was great 3 times in his career (incl. '76 fight with Norton?)?
If not, how many ?

And how about Dempsey, Louis, Marciano ?
How many nights were they great ?

I just want to get a bit of context to the statement "Frazier was a great fighter for just one night of his career".

 

On that note, was Floyd Patterson ever a great fighter ?

 

No. He exposed where Frazier was at -at that time in his career. That is the hard truth because it explains how Foreman could not get past a 32 year old Ali.

There is no taking away what Frazier did up until that point. Great for 3 years, there was nothing more to add to his resume. he beat the best out there, paid his dues already but his time was up.

Was there anyone better than Ali, Quarry, Ellis, Bonnavena and Chuvalo that Frazier did not fight before 1972?

 

Largely agree with this viewpoint.

Frazier was a devastating force from roughly '67 to the FOTC, with an actual physical peak in '69.

Post-FOTC, he was clearly no longer the same fighter.

The fact that he kept getting up against the awesome punching of one of the hardest punchers in history is actually further testament to his heart and durability, something that the smaller types on this forum simply can't assimilate.

Frazier was clearly great, albeit in a shortish time period.

 

The only thing "exposed" here is that you simply don't know what the hell you're talking about.

Hard truth.

:hi:

 

Quarry was actually borderline great, Ellis was good, so was Bonavena. The only thing Joe lacks is longevity, and of course there are the two unranked opponents mcvey likes to talk about. But the thing is there can be made pertinent excuses for Frazier defending against Daniels and Stander after FOTC, and a fighter with his style, not to mention his health issues, can't really fight top contenders, constantly, for long.

 

:roll:

Troll.

 

Hard truth.

 

What Frazier are we talking about here? Marvis?

 

He beats all except the two Klitschkos and Haye, he may beat the Klits with that great left hook the same with Haye but these fighters have the firepower to worry Joe. But you have to look at what Joe did to Ali and Ali was clinching and holding all night, Joe just wears them down if they don't knock him out first.

 

No. Frazier won the biggest fight of all time. Foreman was just a bad style match up and also a great fighter in his own right. If Chuck Wepner KO'd Joe I would say yes.