Papke-Carpentier footage.

That's not what he told writers in confidence the day after their bout in 1923 (not decades later). He didn't want to make excuses so he wasn't vocal about it. What he told them was that Dempsey was "not the Killer he's made out to be", that Miske hit as hard or harder and that Dempsey hit him low the whole bout which took the steam out of him. He then showed a couple writers and the timekeeper bruises in his groin area... which must have been titillating.

I will get you the direct quotes later when I am in my library. It's from Moyle's book on Miske.

#correct as usual.

 

I don't care about your single quote where you have no idea of his mindset at that time. My Dad had years of speaking with Gibbons and he reflected on not only this bout but others over that time. This was not Gibbons in front of reporters or writers but one friend to another. The difference is my Dad was a great boxing fan so he asked many good questions. His bout with Dempsey I am sure was talked about often as he was a big Dempsey fan.

 

Based on your comments at least 3-4 of the bouts were close affairs.

The info I posted all indicates close fights.

 

So you dont care about direct attributable quotes from Gibbons unless you offer them? That sounds reasonably intellectual and even handed. And these comments you do endorse, since the eminate from your font of knowledge, are filtered through someone who was, by ypur own admission a Dempsey fan?

Are your people from Minnesota? The Gibbons boys rather fascinate me.

 

No...your quote as I mentioned was a single incident and who knows why Gibbons said what he said that one time. What Gibbons said to my Dad was over years talking as friends. As mentioned my Dad was a huge boxing fan so I am sure he asked lots of great questions. Knowing what I know now I wish I had recorded all the stories he had from that time. There was no debate...Gibbons told my dad Dempsey hit him the hardest.

My dad was from PA but during the depression he like many traveled everywhere looking for work....first out to Detroit, Chicago then St Paul....finally back to the east coast where he settled down in NY and later NJ...where I am today.

 

Looking at who Gibbons fought, it would make sense if it was Dempsey who hit him hardest, but Gibbons, not but hours after the event stated these things. And Gibbons reiterated Dempsey's foul tactics over a period of weeks. More to the point Dempsey hit hardest those who moved worst.

Back to Carpentier... i just can't accept him as a great. A sellable commodity at the time? Sure.

Much more interesting, more stories from your dad about Tommy or Mike.

 

Carp won many titles. Although you decry him in his bout with Papke ...he went those many rounds as a kid against a full fledge ATG. Like many he came from Europe where perhaps competition early on was not the best but he did fight and beat many top notchers during his career. Loughran stating Carp gave him his hardest bout says plenty.

 

Man...wouldn't that be wild!

 

i would take what gibbons said to mr houdinis dad over what he said to a newspaper guy anyday of the week. hell, he could be relaxed and know it would not be printed. same as to the trainers and pros i spoke with in gyms over the years as an amatuer and coach. the very last thing dempsey had to worry about was power - if he jabbed his way in more, well it might be dempsey and - who else

 

"I would take what some unknown guy on the internet says Tommy Gibbons told his dad 80 years ago over what was actually quoted from a respectable source the next day..." OOOOKKKK.

 

This was not just one conversation. This was years of conversations one friend to another and he never wavered. Dempsey hit him the hardest.

 

suit yourself. gibbons also said "lord, how that man can hit" reffering to dempsey

 

What do you mean by a respectable source ?
Newspaper guys make up quotes all the time, and mis-quote all the time, and in 1923 probably a lot more than these days.

 

I often find it odd how prize fighters apparently spoke, and their choice of words, according to newspapermen quotes of the day.