when will ward step up

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by lepinthehood, Oct 30, 2013.

  1. des3995

    des3995 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I do think that if he comes thru his fight with Rodriguez in good fashion, and can't get a big fight at 168, his work will be concluded there.
    But the notion that Ward is ducking Kovalev is nonsense.
     
  2. bailey

    bailey Loyal Member Full Member

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    I think one of the things Des is that Ward is in a very empty division, he beat Kessler who had already been found and then Kessler beat Froch who beat Bute etc and the division was without a name for Ward. People say why does an undefeated record matter, but Froch beating Bute in the fashion he did, took the shine off of a Ward/Bute match up.
    Kovalev is a name that I think people are throwing down because he is an undefeated world champ and Ward has yet to face one of those as of yet.

    If Groves beats Froch and I think that is very possible that could become a potentia match up in a year or so and J DeGale would be a good match up for Ward with his fast hands
     
  3. des3995

    des3995 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    'Sup B?, I don't hear many people, if any, demanding Ward (or any fighter for that matter) beat an undefeated world champ. Those are circumstiantial measuring sticks, and don't tell anything on their own merit.
     
  4. technocrato

    technocrato Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Like it or not, Ward did duck Bute (who beat Bika more convincingly than Ward).

    Like it or not, Ward never fought an unbeaten champ.

    Like it or not, Ward is a homer who didn't want to fight Froch in England or Kessler in Danemark.
     
  5. JAB5239

    JAB5239 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Ward has possibly the best resume in boxing at the moment. If he needs to step up than what does that say about 99% of the rest of the fighters in the world?
     
  6. bailey

    bailey Loyal Member Full Member

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    People note he didnt do any of them though
    People wont want to read that

    Possibly best resume at moment :lol::patsch.
    Many active boxers have better resumes. Wards best win is Kessler who was a past best unwell double vision suffering fighter who was beaten by the old end of career previous champ. If you think Wards got a good resume for Kessler then you really are dreaming.
     
  7. des3995

    des3995 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Critics need something to point at, I guess.

    It doesn't matter. It's not a barometer with any validity.

    Undefeated is circumstantial. Depends on the opposition.

    World Champion has become a fly by night accolade. I almost think boxing would be better off with NO belts with all these ridiculous belts, and the even more ridiculous levels of the same belt. WGAS?

    The fighter himself is more important than the belt or his "0".

    So looking for an "undefeated world champ" on a guy's record is not at all like saying he beat "the man" or the best of the division.
     
  8. Boxer-MMASux

    Boxer-MMASux Active Member Full Member

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    Site Vote:

    Change the name of ESB from Eastside Boxing to ESIWKAB, Eastside Idiots Who Know Nothing About Boxing.
     
  9. bailey

    bailey Loyal Member Full Member

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    I guess its all open for debate.
    As you know I am a big fan of the SMW division and have followed it from very early on.
    Ward is one of my favourite active fighters, mainly because of the interest I have with the division, but he has made it easy to be critical even though I dont blame any decisions.
    ie In a competition where all of the original contestants fought as an away fighter except Ward. He left himself open with that, though you have to give props to his team for giving him home advantage as it seems to be very important at SMW.
    He chose not to fight Bute after the S6. That was a loss of the biggest fight available for Ward against what was deemed his toughest challenge and due to styles making fights possibly would have been.
    He fought Dawson at SMW not LHW, though you cant blame that on Ward if it was what Dawson was willing to do, but it took the shine off of what would have been a reasonable win evenif not a great win.
    An undefeated record often shows a fighter that is hard to beat, but you are correct in saying its who they beat also. I think beating the man has become a bit watered down, Ward never got the chance to beat the man but came the man for beating Kessler and the rest happened. LHW is similar, in that both are short of top fighters. I guess a few years ago we were a bit spoilt and never knew
     
  10. des3995

    des3995 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Don't know how any of it relates to "the undefeated world champ" thing. It's still just kind of an arbitrary set of circumstances.

    Can't argue with the above criticism of Ward. Coulda fought Bute and while I do believe he intended to, Froch blew that out of the water and snagged the glory.

    He did beat the de facto man when he beat Kessler. (The man isn't always undefeated nor the world champ. As a matter of fact, there are hardly any world champs around anymore. Just titlists leveraging their titles.)
     
  11. bailey

    bailey Loyal Member Full Member

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    The undefeated champ bit - If Ward had of fought Bute after the S6 it would have been considered his biggest test and it would have been considered his biggest fight. Why? Because Bute was an undefeated world champ at the weight who had looked very good against common opponents and made more defences even if he hadnt fought at the level of Ward, Kessler or Froch. After Bute was beaten it wouldnt have been as big a fight even if Bute was to come back and look great against several top 10 SMWs and avenge the Froch loss in great fashion. Unbeaten vs unbeaten seems to sell and hold interest as well as two fighters who havent learnt what it is like to lose and trying to hold onto their 0
     
  12. YCGS

    YCGS Boxing Addict Full Member

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    These Ward defenders always seem to forget that Darnell Boone even existed. Ward is overrated.
    He has fought in one division his whole career, only fights in his backyard, has only 26 fights and was nearly rendered mentally ******ed by Darnell fricking Boone.
     
  13. second to none

    second to none Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Whats wrong with fighting in one divison Hagler only fought at MW, Pep at FW better to fight the best and rule one division then pick up abc belts in other weights like Broner is doing, Ward hasn't fought in over a year this is a first fight back thing, guarantee after this it will be Stevenson or Kovalev and trust me Ward will school both, Stevenson and Kovalev are overrated Kovalev has beaten who Cleverly nothing compared to Froch, Kessler, Dawson is it.
     
  14. des3995

    des3995 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    There were questions surrounding Bute before, during and after the Super 6 tourney. He hadn't proven himself (irregardless of the circumstances) against top competition. Those questions were there despite the "0". Because it was circumstantial. It wasn't validated against the best of his contemporaries.

    Yes, it is a nice aside, and may draw in the casuals, and the fanboys of each fighter, but when 2 guys with their "0" meet, it doesn't suddenly improve either fighter. It is first and foremost, a marketing tool. Nor does it make the loser suddenly a worse fighter than he was before the fight. Each guy is different. With his own resume, level of comp, challenges, etc.
     
  15. JAB5239

    JAB5239 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Are you saying Wards resume isnt amongst the best? He has basicly cleaned out 168 which was seen as a deep division. Tell me, over the past 5 years can you name 5 fighters that have beaten the same level of comp as Ward?