Someone explain why Ray Leonard is ranked so highly?

So what if he did lose to Duran first time round. It was a great fight against a great fighter who was around his peak with bags of experience. Leonard was probably a better fighter afterwards for the experience and whatever way you look at it he won the return. It's not as if only unbeaten fighters can be great fighters. This is the fight game, all the top fighters lost fights.
I've got to say that I'm actually a bigger fan of Duran than Leonard but some of the arguments to discredit Ray on this thread are just ridiculous.
If you don't rate him top 10 ATG then fair enough, he might not make my top 10 if I did one. He was a great fighter though.

 

dont preach to me u lowly personal trainer. I read it two weeks b4 the fight. u cant just erase what it said

fact is, polls show it was about even with a slight edge going to Hagler. same with the regular joe on the street, many of whom picked Leonard

add to that Hearns, & Arum

so he got the nod over a totally used up Hagler, BIG DEAL. what do u expect after 6 yrs waiting?

u want to talk REAL upsets, lookit Norris - Leonard

find ONE expert that picked Terry to win

cant find none!



that's just the way it is son! so stop making up excuses AFTER the fact. i believe they call it monday morning quarterbacking

hey peabrain check this out: Sugar Ray Leonard, 5 championships, unbeaten in 11 yrs, a prohibitive favorite with NOT ONE member of the press picking in his favor, upset the odds and Leonard

and it wasnt even close

 

I caught u. When the cat's away, the mice will play!

Leonard #6? over Monzon?

this is sheer nonsense and doesnt come close to adding up

how does a record of 35-3-1 beat a record of 120-9-3 with no losses in 14 yrs and never having been stopped?

so he split decisioned a shot Hagler, and a 29 yr old lightweight, jumped up two divisions

Monzon did even better - tkod Napoles, Benvenuti, Griffith, w 15 Briscoe, Valdez (2X) with 14 successful defenses, compared to leonard's 4

no way is he over Hagler or Jones either. They did more, they were in with better people. Hagler would kill the media darling prime 4 prime and Roy would have Sugar shitting in his pants by rd 3 with his peerless handspeed

one good shot to the ribcage would have leonard helpless and on the canvas with ten being counted over him

i cant believe all the nuckleheads here actually impressed with a win over a way over the the hill Hagler, pretending they dont hear the comments coming from Ryan

too bad he didt have the same luck with Norris

i'll give him slack with Camcho but never against Norris

no way does he compare with Johnson either. Ray would never without organized help, even get a title shot in those days and would never DARE initiate a match the way Johnson did

he's nothing but a BOY and would just accept his lot in life. see what I mean?

and the original Leonard, Benny, is three times the fighter Ray Leonard was. SRl with his measly record of 36-3-1, actually had to wait out the prime of the best fighter he ever faced and openly ducked at least two others (pryor & Nunn)

and refused to defend his cheapass WBC title that was gifted to him out of fear he'd get the same treatment Norris dished out to him!

he totally caved to the first fast young fighter who came his way - Norris, a fighter with the speed to stay a step ahead of him in their fight/ what makes that so special???

I could see if he actually BEAT Terry Norris but he was totally embarrased & outclassed

to say that Terry picked a fight with him is another lie. it was Terry that was challeneged by Ray. Ray just bit off more than he could chew

Even had he beat Norris the way he was supposed to, he sill wouldnt be worthy of a #6 ranking

your ranking is totally ungrounded and seems to be nothing more than wishful thinking

your ridiculous ranking of him is more proof of the way some people still overrate him

 

You wrote.

The loss he had to Duran was so close that it could be scored a win for Leonard.

I say that is bollox. I'm quite happy with the official verdict, all 3 judges giving it to Duran.

I was also very happy with the amount of times Carlos Padilla knocked Leonards gloves away instead of calling break, because every time it was him that tried to clinch when the going was tough.

A clear win for Duran.

I think there is a case for people to rate Whitaker over Archie Moore, or Ezzard Charles, though I wouldn't.

You on the other hand, categorically rate Leonard over Duran Hagler, Moore, Arguello, and Monzon.

Based on what exactly? How good Leonard was at the negotiating table? Because his 40 fight resume doesn't hold a candle to any of theirs.

I think you are too impressed with what some might say was a gift against a well past it Hagler, a definite gift with the draw against Hearns, and the No Mas with a not very well trained Duran.

A very good box / fighter, but nothing in that 40 fight record warrants 6th all time ever.

 

Duran is the only one of the big 4 who is an atg

Hearns was chinny
Haggler beat up midgets , got old quick

Leonard, best win was against a weight drained zombie hearns who had no chin anyway

Leonard only beat a fat Duran after a loss

Leonard beat haggler who was shot to ****

Duran beat prime Leonard
Was a terrible matchup for hearns

If Duran had imposed the same rules Leonard had against haggler , Duran would have won because he was winning after the 12th

And unlike Leonard, Duran fought the prime haggler, prime hearns too

Unlike Leonard hearns and haggler, Duran aged well enough to beat Barkley

Duran is a legit atg

The others are hyst hofers

Hearns probably isn't even a hall of famer

 

Yowzers, poor Hearns.

 

You fuking idiot, you know zip about the history of Leonard/Hearns do you, you mutt. All wanks like you can do is to take a statement out of context in the pathetic attempt attempt to gain brownie points amoung the rest of the zombies on here, twat! Go read Roosters post I was replying too.. thicko!

 

I would rate SRL a great fighter. At Welterweight, perhaps his best weight, I have him at 3rd greatest. What always made me dis-like him though was that he would negotiate things into the contract that would favor him come the fight. If you wanted some of that SRL money, you would agree. But more power to him perhaps.

Always remember how he crushed Dave 'Boy' Green...Frightening KO.

1) SRR
2) Mickey Walker
3) SRL
4) Barney Ross/Kid Gavilan

 

Go read the Roosters post, Red was just slightly mistaken in the regards to who called who out, hence my input, Don't want too see anyone getting the wrong idea here that it was Hearns who was quaking in his boots, that's why I mentioned the after fight presser where Tommy came in & threw the chicken at Leonard & Leonard said it ai'nt gonna happen.

SRL or Dundee wanted absolutely no part of Hearns, regardless of Angelo's hoopla old school fight hype, a 2nd defeat for Leonard meant the end of the $$$$$ train, Hearns was too dangerous a foe as was proved that night in September when he dominated Leonard. Leonards camp had no choice but to take the unification fight, much the same as when Leonard talked his way into a Hagler showdown in early 82. But when it looked like that was what the public now demanded & with no way now to get out of it, SRL strapped that parachute to his back & jumped out of the plane door leaving no forewarding address.

 

Wow...sometimes LOL doesn't quite say it. I think it's safe to say that if you win world titles in five different weight classes, your ticket to the HOF is justifiably punched. To say nothing of what he did to Duran.

 

Fixed it for you.:good

Though I disagree about Tommy not being a hof' er.

 

He fought few times, but so many of those fights were against top-level opposition. But he is a bit overrated for the following reasons.

He is a recent fighter, and so his fights can be seen in color on youtube with great commentary. Young fans prefer to watch his fights rather than a guy like Gene Tunney whose fight films are all in black and white without commentary. Boring to most people.

Also, he had a personality that attracted viewers and made them want to follow his career. Same can't be said of the old-time fighters, since TV didn't really do fight build-ups back then.

 

It is true as far as I know that Leonard was offered a Hearns fight well before they were champs but there was no money in it. From what I've heard Dundee turned it down simply because he knew it would be a massive fight down the line.

 

I agree with you, I think you'll always get the sentimental rating. After all he is recent considering a few of us on here remember his career as it happened. Sometimes fellas ftrom the past are overlooked just because most people don't remember them or know to much about the fellas they fought.
I've got to sat though, Leonard looked like a great fighter to me and against good fighters.

At his peak and best fighting weight in particular.

 

Hagler not an ATG, whaaaa?

He fought midgets? He fought all comers, was not at all tall, 5' 9" for a MW, was a prime Hearns a midget? He had plenty of fights, should have won the won before he took the title but was given a draw, & likely deserved no worse than a draw against SRL, even when somewhat past his prime. Had amongst the greatest chins ever, saw him #1 on 1 list. Was undefeated for years.

Anyone else not see him as an ATG?