Is Calzaghe really the greatest SMW?

why set the bar as low as just 10? You seem to like low standards.

jones, toney, nunn, eubank, leonard, hearns, Watson, ward, reid, Liles. That's 10 already and I am just warming up.


but why would you want me to stop at 10 at all?
pre injury echols
Benn on his night.
kessler might well shade him at home without his injury
I don't like including a definite Ottke home win but why not add it - its likely what would have happened in Germany.
Some argue Glen Johnson set the fear of God into Joe and he ran feigning hand injuries , but I hope you understand we are well beyond the 10 you asked for so don't put too much weight on that, make it easy on yourself with the other 13. joe running from froch might be because of an impending defeat but now we are splitting hairs at 16 and I wouldn't include that in this list myself.

I don't mind going on of course to 20.



bear in mind I am saying H2H here and not 'more accomplished', which is the stake that I believe Joe wins out in. I say that just in case you are one of these sneaky types who pretends later on that they were arguing about something else all along.

 

top opponents means tough fights where I am from.

if tough opponents means easy fights, or easy fights means tough opponents where you come from, then I wish you well in Noddyland.

 

Tough fights means tough fights and top opponents means top opponents where I'm from. Most people would want easy fights against top opponents.

 

and what division offers easy fights against the top opposition at world level?

apart from topsy turvy land ones.

 

Calzaghe vs Lacy, Pacquiao vs Hatton etc seemed pretty easy or not "tough fights" imo.

 

Because if it ws an argument based purely on ability and no accomplishment then Jones would be in with a good shout.

And while I do not believed Ward's resume is stronger than Calzaghe the fact remained that Calzaghe's best wins at Super Middleweight - prime Kessler, 2/3 years past prime Eubank and Lacy - are no stronger than Wards - prime Froch 1/2 years past prime Kessler and Abraham.

 

Mkrtchyan was **** - no excuses for that one.
Byron Mitchell was a good win, after losing debatable to Ottke. But that was his only fight in 2003. Very frustrating to have been around then - dunno if you were born then to have seen these fights - surely you must have asked for more from him?
Pudwill was ****, but I guess he was unlucky for the pull-out.
Sheika was a decent win on paper, although I don't know if he got a robbery win against Johnson or not? Also, saying Johnson had a close MD with Froch is like advocating Froch having 115-113 against Ward - you can't always take scorecards as gospel.

Imagine if Froch or Ward were fighting these patsies, sometimes only once a year. I admire them for taking on the hardest opponents each fight and not only lookign to prolong their undefeated records, especially Froch fighting abroad.

 

Joe Calzaghe clearly has the best SMW resume of all time.

But I do consider Roy up there as well, for his dominance of a top undefeated ATG at the weight, though he doesn't come close to Joe's depth of resume.

Calzaghe
Jones
Eubank
Collins
Ward

that is the top 5 off the top of my head, and I do take head to head ability into factor when I decide who is greatest, as all of my top 5 have done more than Jones at the weight. I would take Jones head to head over all of them by the way.

 

kak man lacy was weak to begin with.

hatton didn't find pacman easy, but obviously you mean hatton was easy for pacman. I wouldn't say it was an easy fight, it was tough while it lasted. the prospect of facing Hitman is never easy, ask any number of his opponents.

 

Lacy was a title holder and one of the top opponents at SMW.

Pacquiao didn't seem to have much trouble with Hatton from what I saw. You can disagree but I think you'd be in the minority if you think that was a tough fight for Pacquiao.

 

it was the prospect of a tough fight for certain, but you can disagree if you think it didn't promise a tough fight.


remember this is about wanting and not wanting tough fights/opps, and not necessarily the actual outcome.


but lacy is kak however you spin it - not withstanding it was a good performance from joe that night, when he looked best - a well deserved win in a unifier. lacy was maybe joes 4th best ever opp at smw.

 

Well in that case Lacy was also a tough prospect. More people probably picked Lacy to beat Calzaghe than Hatton to beat Pacquiao.

I think Pacquiao and most other boxers would like all their fights to be like Pacquiao vs Hatton (i.e. not tough).

 

yes I admitted he was a good show for Joe too, his 4th best IMHO. Now that's not saying much, his 4th best show was against a musclebound slow steroid puncher. I don't see any need to adjust my statement.

yeah, uh Pacman and Hatton both test themselves against the best regularly. They are nothing like Joe.

 

1. Pac still hasn't fought Mayweather so I'm not sure about him fighting "the best".
2. I never said Pacquiao and Hatton were like Joe.
3. I still think Pacquiao, Hatton and most other boxers would rather easily KO someone in 2 rounds like Manny did Hatton or easily school someone like Calzaghe vs Lacy than have a "tough fight" so I see no reason to adjust my statement.

 

Calzaghe was the best at 168, and unlike SOB Ward, Calzaghe did not refuse to fight outside his home town or country.............................SOB is a fraud...........Stevenson sure wants to knock Ward out, but Ward refuses to fight him at 175 or even at 168.................