Joe Louis Vs. Wladimir Klitschko

:cheers

 

atsch Joe was a southpaw for starters and had a unique style like nothing boxing ever saw before. Comparing his unique unmatched style to crude plodder like Marciano is stupid.

 

dinovelvet. This is one of his crazy theories.

 

Again you are a complete fool.

Calzaghe was inspired by his favourite boxer and fought in his image.
His style was 100 years old. High workrate, hight punch output. That was it:rofl

 

Keep going fool. Let everybody what sort of ******s follow the Klitschko's.

 

You got run off one fourm under the name 'copernicus' because everybody laughed and made a mockery out of you.
Your opinion isn't worth isn't worth water to an Arab.

 

Nice post Dino. :good

 

Aquamarine,

But there's no real evidence to suggest that it's progressed, and it does so with every decade that goes by. Again, my point was that it doesn't progress in the same way as other sports that people have mentioned. Go and look at the current world records for swimming. All the current world records are from the last 5 years. It progresses every decade in a big way. But boxing doesn't. Today's top fighters don't seem to be any better than the best guys of the 80's and 90's in my honest opinion.

That's fair enough, but if you have a great knowledge of the sport, you can have an EDUCATED guess.

You can access a fighters skillset, and their competition etc, and form an educated, objective opinion.

Even though I can't prove it, I personally believe that peak versions of Tyson, Holmes and Holyfield would beat Wlad.

I believe that SRL and Hearns would beat Floyd and Manny.

I believe that Spinks would beat Stevenson.

I believe that Roy would beat Ward etc.

Again, I can't prove it.

The only thing I'm arguing against, is people that are claiming that boxing has progressed and it does so in the same way as other sports.

I think there's certain skills, that aren't as common now. Such as body punching, double hooks, uppercuts and in fighting etc.

The fighters you have listed above, are/were all great fighters.

But again, in my honest opinion, they aren't any better than the top fighters from the 80's and 90's.

We could do some fantasy fights, and gauge the other members opinions?

 

What does this prove?

We've seen footage of them both fighting in actual fights.

We know what skills Joe possessed, and we know what skills Wlad possesses in actual fights.


Here's a video of SRR training.

http://youtu.be/IBBiQx8bMDU


What do you think?

 

Off that video above, I would not disagree. However, we have no context of this training video at all. If you ask me, it looks like he has just broken camp, because his timing on that speedbag is way off, and also on the skipping. Without context, it's almost impossible to draw anything off this, other than that Louis' timing is poor there.

But why did you post the worst possible training video of Louis?
If you look at the videos below, he looks a lot better.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4lFe82ackq8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y4yFNYij5xM

One must keep in mind that those older speedbags are heavier and thus don't rebound off the top of the board quite as quickly. Perhaps if they used identical equipment, then we could have a better comparison. Obviously, that isn't possible.

Besides all of this, I'd rather look at fighting footage, which gives us a better impression of the end product.
Even in Wlad's videos, there isn't a whole lot to actually go on. He does look good on the speedbag though, I will admit.

 

True. If Walcott could outbox Marciano what chance does Marciano stand against the greatest SMW of all times.

 

Aquamarine,

Fair enough. But I think that we can prove that boxing doesn't progress like swimming etc. Otherwise there'd be no doubt.

Bowe was his own worst enemy. You never knew which version of him would turn up. I don't mind Wlad, but I think he's overrated, and I believe that this current HW division is weak.

That's fine. It's good that we have different opinions.


Why don't we do some fantasy fights, between today's top guys, vs the best from the 80's and 90's, just for fun?

I'd like to see what peoples opinions are.

Like you say, nobody can be right or wrong, but it interests me a lot.

You can either just say who you think would win, or you can elaborate a little, and tell us why.


If you've got the time, pick a winner from the following:


(some of these fights have happened, but this is a list, with each fighter being at their best. Feel free to add some more.)


SRL vs Floyd - WW

Hearns vs Floyd - WW

Duran vs Floyd - LW

SRL vs Manny - WW


Hearns vs Manny - WW

Duran vs Manny - LW

Pryor vs Floyd - LWW

Pryor vs Manny - LWW


De La Hoya vs Floyd - WW/LMW

De La Hoya vs Manny - WW


Mike McCallum vs Alvarez - LMW

Hearns vs Alvarez - LMW


SSM vs Gamboa - LW

SSM vs Manny - WW

SSM vs Bradley - WW

SSM vs Alvarez - LMW


Trinidad vs Manny - WW

Trinidad vs Floyd - WW


Pea vs Floyd - WW

Pea vs Manny - WW

Pea vs Gamboa - LW


G Man vs Martinez - MW

G Man vs GGG - MW


Roy Jones vs Martinez - MW

Roy Jones vs GGG - MW

Roy Jones vs Calzaghe - SMW

Roy Jones vs Ward - SMW

Roy Jones vs Kovalev - LHW


Hopkins vs GGG - MW

Hopkins VS Martinez - MW


Nunn vs Martinez - MW

Nunn vs GGG - MW


James Toney vs Martinez - MW

James Toney vs GGG - MW

James Toney vs Ward - SMW

James Toney vs Calzaghe - SMW


Hagler vs GGG - MW

Hagler vs Martinez - MW


Michael Spinks vs Kovalev - LHW

Michael Spinks vs Stevenson - LHW


Mike Tyson vs Wlad

Larry Holmes vs Wlad

Lennox Lewis vs Wlad

Evander Holyfield vs Wlad


Mike Tyson vs Vitali

Larry Holmes vs Vitali

Evander Holyfield vs Vitali

 

And Wlad is fighting a forklift driver next. :hey

 

No, but I have seen how today's heavyweights fight each other. I don't see why their show of talent should diminish, do you?

Honestly, do you really feel that Tyson Fury or Bermane Stiverne or whomever are showing us a higher level of talent than Louis did? Even when fighting utter cans, Wilder looks quite amateurish.

 

Like fist has mentioned, we don't know the context of the training, and the bags were bigger etc.

I've seen footage of Ali throwing wide shots on the heavy bag that doesn't look great.

But look at the actual footage of the fights.


You can say that Louis didn't fight the same guys that Wlad has been fighting.

But you can study his movements and his shot selection etc. That is there for all to see.


Wlad currently favours two punches and then a clinch.

According to Elroy, that's all he needs to be successful.

That to me, just highlights the sorry state of the HW division.


If you analyse Wlad, there's no double hooks, uppercuts, body punches, quick fire combinations of 4-5 shots etc. No ability of in fighting.


His last showing was horrible.


With regards to the SRR video, his work on the speed bag also looks like Louis's work.