the jones jr debate.

Im sure he would have.

But like he said in the same interview, politics got in the way.

 

Harding was no push over come one now look what he did to in their previous fight ..And in no way did Jones recover from that weight loss in the 2nd Tarver fight ..His signs of decline were there in their first fight ..But then again I ask you do you have video evidence to back up your claims

 

I'm not sure what the debate is here. RJJ was probably the best fighter I have ever seen, while in his prime. IMO, Mayweather doesn't come close. RJJ was willing to get in there with the best and go toe to toe. Unbelievable talent and power. He had it all.

I don't think Tarver touches him in his prime.

The one qualifier is, of course, how good his chin was LATE. I think it was solid for most of his career but the reality is as fighters age, the beard may not hold up as well.

But to RJJ's credit he mixed it up. He put himself at risk because he was like the roosters he bred for ****fighting. He loved it and he wanted to mix it up.

 

It would have been great to have seen him fight more fights in his 'seek and destroy' mode that he was in for the Montell Griffin rematch.

 

-The Nunn fight was put on the table for Jones in: 95, 97, 98 and 99. You cannot use the he was going up to hw as a excuse for Jones consistently looking the other way every time the Nunn fight was put on the table.

-His own advisor, Levin, would state that Jones did not want to vacate the lhw belt

-Jones's reason for refusing to fight Nunn in 97 was because he did not want Nunn to make 600k. So why is it that you keep using going up to hw as a excuse?

Jones' decision due today on Nunn fight

The Cyber Boxing Zone Newswire

-He looked the other way every time the fight was put on the table.

1: He made a offer because HBO were on his case. They were openly unhappy with the quality of his opponents up to that point.

-How much did Jones offer? You are talking about a fighter who did not want Nunn to get 600K
-How much did Liles want?

Seth Abraham would state that Jones made no real attempt to make any of the smw fights.

http://www.thesweetscience.com/columnists/ron-borges/6327-boxings-mantle-what-is-roy-jones-legacy

2: Nunn should of won the Liles fight

 

general zod,

I'm not making any excuses. I'm asking if Roy ducked Nunn out of a fear of been beaten, looking at different factors from a logical standpoint.

A duck in my opinion, is someone who avoids another fighter out of a fear of losing to them.

Other than a duck, a fighter can dismiss someone, or they can chose not to fight, because they're not happy with the terms of the contract, such as: the purse, the weight, the PPV split and if there's to be future options etc.

When one guy wants to fight, and the other guy doesn't, it's always automatically declared as a duck. But that's not always the case.

Again, all I'm doing is asking logical questions.

If Roy feared a past his best Michael Nunn, it's not logical in my opinion, that he'd have made an offer to Frankie Liles, and then he'd have gone on to fight Tarver in his mid 30's, Calzaghe at nearly 40, and Lebedev at 42, way past his prime.

It doesn't make sense to me.

Now it's easy to say that Roy repeatedly looked the other way, and that he turned down offers in 95, 97, 98 and 99 to fight Nunn. I'm not disputing that he did that. But what were Roy's circumstances? Boxing's a business. If Roy turned the opportunities down to go with what he thought were better options, then I can't see a problem. Now let's look at what he did instead of fighting Nunn. In 97, he looked to go to HW, to fight for way more than what he'd have got for fighting Nunn. In 98, he fought for the WBA belt against Lou Del Valle, as well as fighting Virgil Hill for around $3m, that included a Rolls Royce as a gift. Then in 99, he won the IBF title against Reggie Johnson. So from 97-99, he gained two major titles, a Rolls Royce and he made a lot of money. In the midst of Roy gaining those things, Nunn had lost a close fight to Rocchigiani in Germany, who you've described as a 'Woods' level fighter.

You've also stated that Nunn wouldn't fight Frazier which was a mistake, and that he was pushed into a fight with Woods, that never happened. Now it's perfectly understandable, to see why Nunn and Goossen were so angry. Roy also pushed Tarver and Harding into an eliminator back then as well. He represented three organisations, so he always had three mandatories to fight. We also know that Roy had a lot of power back then, as proved by the WBC's outrageous decision to hand him back his belt that he'd relinquished.

So I feel sorry for Nunn, because he badly wanted to fight Roy, just like Steve Collins did. But you have to ask the question, what do you think Nunn would have done had he been in Roy's position? Every fighter has a different set of circumstances surrounding them. In these debates, you have to look at things from different perspectives. Now you're only looking from the perspective of Michael Nunn. If you'd have been Roy, who would you rather have fought, Nunn for $1.8m, or a guy like Frazier for more? So yes, Roy did repeatedly go with other options, and unfortunately for Nunn, he kept getting left behind. But in my opinion, that still isn't proof that Roy ducked him out of a fear of losing.

Nobody has ever made Roy do something that he didn't want to do.

But Roy stated on HBO that he'd made Liles an offer and it was 7 figures. Jim Lampley stated that up to that point, Liles had never made 7 figures. Two of Roy's biggest critics over the years, Larry Merchant and Ron Borges also backed Roy in what he said. They never disputed it. Also, from a previous link that you provided, Liles's manager Jack O'Halloran, said that they had a GREAT fight lined up against Roy, but Liles blew it by asking for more money. At which point O'Halloran walked away.

So again, why would a guy who was scared of Nunn, tried to have fought Frankie Liles?

I respect his opinion. But he also includes fights at LHW. Who did Roy miss at LHW apart from the obvious? He fought just about everybody who mattered apart from Dariusz M, and we know all about that saga.


Below, was Max Kellerman's opinion on Roy's career, from 2002.


http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CCwQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fa.espncdn.com%2Fboxing%2Fcolumns%2Fkellerman_max%2F1429488.html&ei=tUpNU-6gKZSthQfyj4GoDA&usg=AFQjCNGYQ6o9btaEmRaCUqGL7YgCiLK6uQ

That's irrelevant.

 

Roy was a Glass Jawed fighter. He knew it. His dad knew it. They were not going to risk that Chin against anyone that could punch. Roy asked HBO to make a 90/10 split for a Nunn fight. They told Roy they can't even script a deal so one-sided and unethical.

Jones made delusional demands his whole career to get out of fights. There is a very detailed track record there. Jones thought he should get all the money and the opponent nothing. The way he somehow went through 4 weight classes yet managed to not fight one savage puncher is hilarious also. They were out there and available but for some reason Jones instead fought other contenders. :think

 

Roy would lose to Michael Spinks and Bob Foster.

 

Really, why haven't you mentioned any of this before?

 

roy...like bhop and floyd....was self managed.

do you honestly believe they would choose to fight ppl who could beat them? roy avoided tarver for a reason. he knew tarver didn't respect or fear him. bhop avoided dawson for a reason....

don't get me wrong...i am a fan of these fighters. they are the best the sport has produced over the last 2 decades skill wise. it's easy to look great when u pick and choose your opposition.

 

He didn't avoid Tarver.

He was obligated to fight mandatories from three different organisations, and he asked for Harding and Tarver to be put into an eliminator. His request was accepted, on the condition that he had to fight the winner.

Eric Harding won, so he fought him afterwards.

But as we all know, he then went on to fight Tarver on three occasions.

 

HBO created can crusher

has multiple wins over garbage men, mall security guards and mailmen.

 

I never realized that

James Toney
Bernard Hopkins
Virgil Hill
John Ruiz
Reggie Johnson
Jorge Castro
Thulani Malinga
Clinton Woods
Antonio Tarver
Eric Lucas
Mike McCallum
Montell Griffen
Otis Grant
Julio Cesar Gonzalez

All worked in such menial jobs to supplement their highly successful boxing careers

 

He's the best-of-era in my view, roids or no...roids don't give you steez!

On the comp debate, we definitely never got to see a marriage of the best of the American and European MW/SMW's over the 90's so there's a point to be made there......

1st round against Malinga is special, no-one else did that sort of thing against good fighters, Roy was a phenom when on point certainly.

 

tarver was his mandatory. roy opted to fight ruiz instead.

the excuse...'i can't get up for a fight like that...' was really fear.

"got any excuses tonite roy?" jexplained it all.