Who do you think has the better LHW resume out of Jones and Hopkins?

when did jones' prime begin?

 

Ah,you're right well played. Lacy held the title at SMW.

Griffen beat prime Toney...twice. You dont do that unless you have quality.

Jones beat a guy who beat DM
He beat a guy who beat Nunn in his prime, not the drug addled shot fighter, that dropped a decision to Rocchigiani that some people claim Jones ducked.

He beat a guy who beat Tiozzi. (By crushing KO)

Im not sure what any of those fighters would have done for Jones legacy outside of DM.

Erdei spent his entire career beating nobodies outside of JCG and maaaybe Fragomeni. Thats his resume. Beating a guy that Jones toyed with and Fragomeni. No one outside of Germany knew who Erdei was.

 

In order to even continue this discussion, please do not list the Hop win over a shot Jones as one of Hops wins.

If you use this in your argument, then you're just a biased Calzaghe fan. :blood

 

Id put it at about 1993, the night he beat Hopkins was his breakout night.

He had beaten Castro before that, but Hopkins was probably the night he showed how great he was gonna be.

 

1998 @ 168
Frankie Liles
Joe Calzaghe
Richie Woodhall
Sven Ottke
Charles Brewer
Robin Reid
Thomas Tate
Vincenzo Nardiello
Andrej Shkalikov
Vinny Pazienza

1998 @ LHW
Roy Jones Jr.
Dariusz Michalczewski
Reggie Johnson
Graciano Rocchigiani
Lou Del Valle
Eric Harding
Montell Griffin
Michael Nunn
Antonio Tarver
David Telesco



1999 @ 168
Sven Ottke
Joe Calzaghe
Byron Mitchell
Markus Beyer
Charles Brewer
Thomas Tate
Frankie Liles
Richie Woodhall
Robin Reid
Glenn Catley

1999 @ LHW
Roy Jones Jr.
Dariusz Michalczewski
Lou Del Valle
Reggie Johnson
Graciano Rocchigiani
Michael Nunn
Eric Harding
Antonio Tarver
David Telesco
Montell Griffin


2000 @ 168
Sven Ottke
Joe Calzaghe
Bruno Girard
Charles Brewer
Thomas Tate
Dave Hilton Jr.
Dingaan Thobela
Glenn Catley
Byron Mitchell
James Butler

2000 @ LHW
Roy Jones Jr.
Dariusz Michalczewski
Eric Harding
Reggie Johnson
David Telesco
Montell Griffin
Chris Johnson
Antonio Tarver
Greg Wright
Derrick Harmon


2001 @ 168
Sven Ottke
Joe Calzaghe
Byron Mitchell
Antwun Echols
Charles Brewer
Thomas Tate
Eric Lucas
Mads Larsen
Manny Siaca
Markus Beyer

2001 @ LHW
(Roy Jones Jr. - Champion)
Dariusz Michalczewski
Eric Harding
Reggie Johnson
Montell Griffin
Antonio Tarver
Julio Cesar Gonzalez
Bruno Girard
Lou Del Valle
Clinton Woods
Derrick Harmon


2002 @ 168
Joe Calzaghe
Sven Ottke
Antwun Echols
Eric Lucas
Byron Mitchell
Charles Brewer
Mads Larsen
Manny Siaca
Anthony Mundine
Markus Beyer

2002 @ LHW
(Roy Jones Jr. - Champion)
Antonio Tarver
Dariusz Michalczewski
Eric Harding
Montell Griffin
Reggie Johnson
Bruno Girard
Julio Cesar Gonzalez
David Telesco
Lou Del Valle
George Khalid Jones




If we break it down year-by-year...

1998, top five in each division

168lbs: Liles, Calzaghe, Woodhall, Ottke, Brewer
175lbs: Jones, Michaelzewski, Johnson, Rocchigiani, Del Valle

Clearly LHw there.

1999, top five in each division

168lbs: Ottke, Calzaghe, Mitchell, Beyer, Brewer
175lbs: Jones, Michalzewski, Del Valle, Johnson, Rocchigiani




2000, top five in each division

168lbs: Ottke, Calzaghe, Girard, Brewer, Tate
175lbs: Jones, Michalzewski, Harding, Johnson, Telesco



2001 , top five in each division

168lbs: Ottke, Calzaghe, Mitchell, Echols, Brewer
175lbs: Jones (champ), Michalzewski, Harding, Johnson, Griffin, Tarver

175 > 168 but LHW gets points for having a recognized man of the division plus a halfway decent top five under him - better than 168s, anyway. Echols? ICK!

2002 , top five in each division

168lbs: Calzaghe, Ottke, Echols, Lucas, Mitchell
175lbs: Jones (champ) Tarver, Michalzewski, Harding, Griffin, Johnson



The above was information provided by IB in another thread, that I trimmed down for this thread...

I would like someone to argue how on earth 168 was a stronger division than 175 during this time.

LHW was clearly stronger..

Roy's victim Thomas Tate was actually in the top 10 at 168 for years after Roy crushed him.

 

Hopkins didn't just move up to LHW either...


He refused to move up in 02 when Roy was prime, claiming Roy was too big and wanted an unfair split.. Even though Hopkins' natural weight was 175...

4 years later he moved up and fought an even bigger Tarver, and after the fight admitted he could have moved up 4 years earlier.

It was clear, Hopkins moved up to LHW when he felt it was safe, No Roy Jones, No DM.. That to me puts a perfect perspective on how much tougher the LHW division was at that time. And Hopkins' antics against a freshly knocked out shot to **** Jones, really makes me have a hard time imagining Hops beating Roy before his move up to HW... I think Roy is still in his head.

 

As for the original question..

I say it is kind of hard to gauge, with Hopkins and Roy's LHW reigns are in different eras..

But I would have to go for Roy, as I posted above, he all but cleared out the top 10 for years save a couple mainly DM.

Also, Roy did it with more dominance, and didn't use controversial sneaky tactics. Hopkins has looked flat out bad in some of his fights there.

 

The Dawson fight comes to mind when discussing. Hopkins

 

bailey,

Thanks for the reply.

The reason why I've specifically said Nov 96, to May 2004, is because that was Roy's LHW reign.

Once again, Head said that during that period, SMW was stronger and LHW was a barren waste land.

In my opinion, that's clearly not the case.

But you're right, we're going off topic.

So I'll make a thread, and include a poll. :good


Hope you've had a good weekend.

 

:good

 

Hi mate, how's things?

I'd like to borrow this, to ask this question on a separate thread. :good

 

Agreed - but what if Hopkins beats Stevenson?

 

I think if Hopkins beats Stevenson, you'd have to give him huge credit.

If that happened, people would argue that he ranks higher on the ATG list than Roy.

But with regards to this topic, I don't know. His age has got to play a huge factor, but I think Roy was so dominant at the weight (until later on) that he'd still be top.

Roy's two victories over Hill and Griffin were spectacular, and his win against Tarver was his best win at the weight.

Obviously Hopkins beat Tarver much more convincingly, but Roy lost a lot of weight, including actual muscle in a short space of time to make weight.

He was exhausted after 9 rounds, and had to come through adversity to win.

I guess it would also depend on how Hopkins beat Stevenson.

But for me, I still don't think it would be enough.