Prime Sonny Liston vs Prime wladimir klitschko

Liston was rare in the sense that at 6-1 or 6-2 he could match reach with Wlad. Uncommonly long arms for Liston. That may be able to open up the fight more and force Wlad to engage.

They both can hit but between the two I think Sonny takes a better punch. I wouldn`t rule out Wlad winning because he does bring size, skills and power to the table himself.

I`d take Liston but stoppage at some point.

 

If we go with size and the usual opinion of ESB Sonny at 6'ft and 210 gets owned and quickly, if we go by Sonny's performance when challenged mentally Vlad wins. Sonny could hit and had a strong jab but Vlad has the size, range and can move his legs and head (he is not a sitting target) yes we can look at Vlads fights vs Brewster and Sanders and Purity but Purity was a stamina issue and a serious managers mistake making a 12 round fight for a guy who never fought beyond 8, Brewster was hammered all over the ring but came back at a winded Vlad and took his energy with a head and body shot, Sanders was underestimated and because he was a highly avoided guy red flags should have went off. Sonny also had his bad days the 179 lbs Marty Marshall always gave him a fight while young and a prime Sonny was not always a killer. Lets assume Sonny was past it vs Ali but prime for Floyd or Machen or Zora Foley, that version or the best version of Sonny does not get past the rocket like jab of Vlad in fact I think the cautious prime post losses Vlad carefully dominates and shakes Sonny up early (Vlad KO'd serous contenders unlike Cleavland Williams) I think Vlad controls the range, has faster hands and a quicker release and dominates and stops Sonny who he shakes up and punishes. Not sure if Sonny dont answer the bell or gives Vlad the opportunity to keep him down for the count like Leotis Martin, I dont want to hear age because Wlad is 38 and still looks good .....Vlad by KO and it may be quicker than the usual

 

Let's have a dedication to accuracy. Up to 6" in height advantage, not 7" by any possible accounting. Yes you are "supposed to believe" Liston had an 84" reach, this is well documented, you can see in many photos how even his thick arms looked unusually long, + many commented on their freakish length. Liston has LESS of a reach advantage when going to the head due to the angle.

 

I was giving Sonny a good chance until I read that. I think you have changed my mind.:good Liston won't have a size advantage and klit is proven. Prime Liston has good workrate,if he can suck it up he could be difficult but I just think klit deserves to start Favorite.

 

Most heavyweights box Wladimir scared, to the point they don't box him but merely stand up. They concede the fact he is better at jabbing n' grabbing, so their gameplan is quickly reduced to wearing a high guard like a fashion accessory and swinging with their eyes closed.

Opponents are often physically handicapped and gun-shy with not the know-how or tenacity to make something happen...Liston crunches every one of those defects with his boulder-like fists.

At the first bell Wladimir would be surprised (and unnerved) to see that long arm slip its way through his lose guard. Straight away it'd be apparent that he couldn't mince around and chip away. Punches designed to drive their way through the target would have the big man on his heels within the first three minutes, and when that clinch button started flashing, Wladimir would be increasingly horrified to see Liston shake him off with those big shoulders, swoop a few into the gut, and snap that jab back to a quickly reddening face.

The odd right may ping Liston as he trudges forward, though I can't imagine anything more than a slight grimace as he proceeds to turn the Klitschko gameplan inside out. It wouldn't reach the sixth.

 

Liston is about 6" shorter. I don't care how long his arms are... he'd be punching up. He'd have to get close to reach Klitschko as long as Wlad fights tall... which he does very well. Liston would have to get close, you all need to stop with Liston's freakishly long reach. He was 6'1" at the most! I seriously doubt his reach was 84", but even if it was... I've explained this already.

 

Lol...All of these people mentioning the reach "advantage" for Liston.

Is Sonny really going to outjab Wlad? How so? Because he has a 3' advantage in the reach? It's more than that.

1) Wlad is a master of hitting without getting hit.
2) Speed. Wlad is much faster than Sonny in hand speed.
3) Height. Half a foot in height is a huge disadvantage for Liston.
4) Technique and experience. No one has thrown and landed more jabs in a HW championship fight than Wladimir Klitschko.

 

Ok-

1. Get a tape.

2. Stand up, face a wall, keep your back/chest parallel with the wall in front of, and in back of you.

3. Make a fist, touch the wall with it with your arm fully extended and your arm level with the floor. This may involve moving your feet lol

4. Measure the distance from the wall to you.

5. Go 7" above the spot you touched with your fist. And repeat the process. You will have to move your feet again! You will have to move closer to the target.

6. Measure again. You will figure out what I'm saying.

 

The Eddie Machen that got knocked out by IJ in less than a round? Or the conquering Zora Folley that beat him just as bad as Big Bear?

 

Agreed.:good

 

i dont think liston's stamina would look too good once the jabs and massive rights start raining down on him round after round, on the contary, by the eight round he would be busted up and running on fumes.

 

Now, what happens when you have to keep moving closer to the target? You use more energy and you give your opponent more oppurtunities to hit you. That's not good vs. Wladimir Klitschko. Liston will have to bob and weave his way in even though this was not his forte... another tactic that uses a lot of energy.

 

:good he aint a tyson and he aint a frazier.

 

Machen was a pretty good HW as was Folley. Machen was more durable than Foley but Folley was a little better technically. Anyway, Ingo stopped Machen inside of a round. Fluke? Perhaps.

A hard fought decision win over Machen does not prepare you for a guy like Wlad though.

 

The X factor for me is Wlad's footwork and movement. It's a fallacy to suggest that because Wlad didn't match prime Ali in those areas, that he still didn't hold an advantage over Sonny in them. He did.

If someone wants to argue that Sonny is more well-rounded, go ahead. But well-rounded doesn't mean he won't come off looking like a plodding, straight line fighter and wind up eating a lot of hard shots trying to close the gap on Wlad in the process of trying to get inside. Listons a fine all-around fighter, but let's not get things twisted as far as who has the speed (hand and foot) and movement advantage here. I think Wlad picks him off for a UD, if not a late stoppage.