Carmen Basilio vs Floyd Mayweather Junior

Uhhh Robinson was bigger, faster, hit harder, had a better jab, and had much faster feet than Mayweather, he also had a better chin, he basically did everything better than Mayweather and still had ten kinds of hell with Basilio. Basilio was so uber tough, strong, and hard hitting for his size that the ridiculously tough and strong Gene Fullmer opted to box... BOX instead of utilize his usual come forward free swinging style... Floyd isnt staying away from Basilio, hes going to have to trade the only question is whether he can gut it out or cut Basilio. If he falters even a little in the heart dept Basilio is going to whip his ass good. Thats the problem with guys like Jones Jr. and Mayweather who avoid their stiffest challenges, we dont know what they are made of and with so many question marks (not the least of which is why they were so scared to test themselves) then how can anyone really place these guys comfortably against all time great fighters who tested themselves against the best across many styles, weights, etc.

 

Ughh… call me an old-timer but over 15 I will take Basilio. An amalgam of things that bother Floyd… active output, accurate, good crowding footwork and very durable.

 

Floyd UD. Wins 10-2 or 9-3. In 15 12-3 or 11-4

 

Robbie was 36 when he rematched Basilio and with ~150 bouts on his back, fought nothing like Mayweather, he had better alround offensive skills and movement by far, but no way in hell did he have faster feet in terms of springing back when getting backed up. I'm not a fan of Floyd but to deny his skills is plain stupid. Robbie would go balls to the wall when required, but Mayweather
is safety first fighter. And please don't bring up the Maidana fight, because Maidana landed 6-7 hard clean punches in the whole fight. Basilio is just too slow for Floyd. If he gets close too much he will get a forearm across his face. His prime was around the time he captured the WW belt and he was still getting hit left and right by slower fighters. Saxton, DeMarco and Graham were hitting him at will, so were some more. I will usually take the side of the oldschool fighter, again Basilio is one of my favorite fighters, but he isn't beating Mayweather on points.

 

Robinson may have been 36 but he was still better than Mayweather ever was. Everything else you said except Mayweather being a safety first fighter is irrelevent. Especially the comment in regards to Saxton, DeMarco, and Graham. Saxton lost three out of three to Basilio, two by KO, forget the fixed decision against Basilio, Demarco was knocked out twice, and Graham split three fights right down the middle with Basilio. Is that the kind of proof you want to use to illustrate how Mayweather beats Basilio?

 

People must have not watched a whole lot of Basilio.

Carmen was not a boxer or puncher. He was a fighter. He was a street fighter to the highest degree. None of Floyd's skills would matter. He would be forced to trade leather and at 147 that is not his best option.

At 147 Floyd fought Judah, Baldamir, Hatton, Marquez, Mosley, Ortiz, Guerrero, and Maidanna . At this weight Mayweather was not a mover. He like to stand there and trade. He was wobbled by Mosley and his glove touched the ground behind a Judah left hand. He relied on his should-roll and countering skill. He had a tough time holding his ground with Hatton and Maidanna. Floyd is great in my eyes because he can adapt to real world problems and still win...yet the fact is in Basillio Floyd will be facing the best version of guys he has problems with.

I will not include the 160 pound Basilio that fought Robinson. I am speaking of the guy who KO'ed DeMarco and Saxon and put Gavilan on his back for only the second time his career. Carmen hit hard and was fierce and mean. He would be all over Floyd if he felt threatened and if he did not he would circle him looking to land whatever he could.

I see a close fight on points. I think at this weight Floyd is not at his best but Carmen is and Carmen would be at an advantage in a 15 round fight against a guy that would be content to trade with him or run. Either way, Carmen is the hunter and would apply too much educated/wild pressure. Mayweather would be uncomfortable and have to throw more leather each round without much rest.

 

Ok dude, you have your opinion and I have mine. I wasn't talking about the outcomes of those fights, but used them as a reference that Basilio was hittable. He was no Henry Armstrong who wasn't easy to hit and still he was ALWAYS in you face. If Floyd chose the biggest ring possible, Basilio wouldn't catch him. Yes, Robinson is the best fighter ever, he was skillwise well above every single fighter that ever lived - proved by his longevity, but to say that he was very naturally gifted fighter in terms of speed is laughable. He almost punched Graziano's head off, never been lnocked out, he was strong enough but he wasn't among the fastest fighters ever. There is no footage of him at 147 apart from few clips on youtube, and he was just above average in terms of speed at 160. So please, stop with that. Basilio had never faced anyone as fast as Mayweather. Bye

 

Average in terms of speed? I was doing just fine until that part. I am sure that was a statement is an exaggeration on your part because of frustration with klompton...but lets not get carried away.

Lamotta, Basillio, Fulmer, Maidanna, Guerrero, Baldamir, Hatton, and Ortiz had average speed. I would say that Robinson in top five in terms of pound for pound speed. You need to check out the hook he whipped around and floored Fulmer with. Seriously, Fulmer had no idea he was on the canvas. This was old Robinson. I could not imagine if he was in his prime how fast that hook would have come.

 

Wish Basilio was around today. I would pick him to win a close decision against May

 

Yes, there is no footage today of the prime 147 pound Ray Robinson, BUT
sir I saw this version of SRR several times and I could attest to the fact
that Ray Robinson could throw vicious combinations with BLURRING speed
combined with knockout power with either hand...To compare the purely
defensive minded Floyd Mayweather to the immortal WW Ray Robinson
who as the late John Garfield wrote "was a cold stone killer" is sacrilege..

 

PP, I always like your posts,but ... This is the guy who beat the man,I know it was at middle. But, Basilio was NAIL tough and would make Maidana look like a lightweight in comparison. I feel that PBF would not be able to maintain a safe working distance against Basilio. And ,if Floyd was bothered by the likes of Castillo and Maidana. Wait until the Onion Farmer gets up in his grill... IMO, and much respect as always ...

 

Great points here ! Basilio and the fighters from that era, did NOT grow discouraged when the going got tough. Rather, the tough got going ! Basilio would not slow up or mentally quit in the face of Floyd,s skills. ****, SRR (who had way more firepower than PBF) couldn,t get him to wilt. Hard to see Floyd holding up against such a rough and mentally tough fighter the likes of Basilio.

 

Sacrilege....I like that. Couldn't agree more Burt.

 

well put BB, it was a different breeding ground back then and deep wide waters SRR had all the tools. Floyd is the best defensive guy around today but would be a KO victim to Ray and IMO Basilio gives him a rough-tough beating and a loss