I think Cotto is the best he has ever been!

No way is Cotto the best he has ever been! He got dominated by Trout then beat a very average Delvin Rodriguez and a shot to **** Sergio Martinez. I'm a big Cotto fan but he is NEVER a Middleweight. GGG would ruin him!

 

Interesting question. :think I don't know...Middle Cotto is good in different ways than Light Welter Cotto. The influence of Roach is definitely a big factor, if not the main thrust of Cotto's recent success.

It kind of reminds me of a few years ago when Kessler remade himself under Montoya. His physical gifts were greatly tarnished from his undefeated title-holding prime - and some tough injuries had left him physically even worse for wear than he would have been from just age or the general rigors of a pro boxing career by itself - but somehow, in certain ways, the Kessler of 2010 into 2012 who beat Froch, Bouadla, Green and Magee seemed almost better than peak & prime Kessler from 2003 into 2007. Some elements of his game were lost, but he added some news ones and may have even been more versatile in that latter-day period despite having to operate without some of what had previously been his best tools. Cotto seems to have found the same thing with Roach: someone to awaken in him things lying dormant (except more of a rediscovery in his case than a "whole new world" situation like it was for Kessler).

Belaboring that last point, this situation is a bit different, in that Cotto is hardly the wheel reinvented under Roach - basically just getting back to basics and what his strengths were originally during his rise up (which, come to reflect, was actually the same time period as Kessler's peak & prime - both claimed their first world titles in '04 and managed to keep their zeroes for a few years thereafter). Still, he is greatly changed from the fighter he was for most of his welterweight tenure, or at the very least the somewhat broken individual he was in the period his first and most recent defeats, to Margarito & Trout respectively, bookend. Some will argue of course that D-Rod was "just an ESPN level guy" and that Maravilla was a "dead man walking and barely counts" but even accounting for the quality of his opposition in the last year since linking up with Roach, you can see how refueled Cotto is and the proof lies in the pudding of his results. Is simply beating D-Rod all that amazing? No, but destroying him in just over six minutes is. Was toppling a clearly rickety and deteriorating Martinez the most impressive avenue to a lineal championship ever taken? No - but how many natural middles, let alone former light welters, do you suppose would have dropped Martinez 4x, never lost a minute, let alone a round, and retired him? Macklin, Chavez, and Murray are gargantuan next to Cotto and each only dropped the champ once...and they all still lost in the end.

Still, it seems to be an emerging pattern with Cotto and Kessler as salient examples. Very good fighters lose a step and begin to flounder after some tough losses and many years of gloved combat - and then, in the nick of time before they lose all vestiges of their raw talent, chance upon a new dynamic with a 'perfect fit' coach who clicks with them on every level - chemistry, understanding of their style, and their strengths & weaknesses and how to work off them - and proves to be juuuuuust what they needed to make a last run.

Virgil Hunter is kind of attempting to make a career of being exactly that kind of guy. I wonder if we might see a shift away from the most successful coaches being the ones that stick with a kid all the way, to an increased demand for and supply of coaches serving as "damaged goods repair specialists" who seek out fixer-uppers that may have been given up on by most but in whom they can see potential waiting to be wrung out. :think

 

Excellent post IB.

Just fukking excellent.:good

 

Thanks man. It's something I've noticed and found interesting for a while now.

Used to be the prestige of top level trainers came from "building up" a kid from scratch - like D'Amato, Futch, and Dundee (and later Steward, etc)

Now it seems being the equivalent of a "house flipper" to boxing's discards and lost causes is en vogue. (and that actually started as far back as Steward himself, faced with a dearth of talent among domestic youth, taking on the project of "fixing" WK after he was already basically smack in the middle of a pro career...)

 

You don't think Martinez is just shopworn and made Cotto look better than he actually is? Don't get me wrong... I'll be the first to admit that I didn't even give Cotto a chance in this thing, but isn't it completely obvious that Martinez is finished? If Cotto hadn't of done it, what MW titlist or top contender wouldn't have? If Cotto makes a good defense, then I'll be convinced that he's reinvented himself under roach, but until then...... Lets just say that I'm more than skeptical.

 

Very insightful post..... Maybe Cotto has reinvented himself a bit under the tutelage, I guess he deserves a little more credit than he's actually receiving. Hard for me to admit, because I'm a big Maravilla fan, and I just don't think he's anywhere near his best, but Cotto definitely deserves a lot of credit. Here I go contradicting my previous post, thanks a lot IB!

 

It was definitely a bit from column A and a smidgen from column B. :good

 

My 84 year old Uncle could have beat Martinez that night... but Cotto probably has never looked better.

 

I'd like to see Cotto vs. Alvarez at 157 or even 160. I don't think either guy really belongs at MW right now though. Smoke and mirrors my friend.

 

:thumbsup

 

Screw catchweights! :twisted:

 

Yeah, I'm not a big fan either. Either guy could make 157, but why not just make the limit 160.

 

Cotto is indeed a more polished and better fighter than he ever was. I guess he is just a late bloomer in some ways. It's true Rodriguez was not in his league and Martinez may have not have been at his best but Cotto treated them just like he was supposed too. A total ass whooping on both occasions.

 

:deal Especially if for the lineal.

157 would be a FARCE.

 

:happy :ko