Ali vs Marciano: How would it go?

jesus these ****ing BORING guys who did show the interview of ali saying that marciano would have been his hardest match, are pathetic.... it is not a ****ing proof of anything.. ali in the 70s was not the same guy.. the speed is th edifference. the 64-67 version of ali would frustrate rocky, marciano himself called ali "the fastest hw of all time". rocky is not cathing ali.. even he he did.. ali took shots from heavier punchers.. rocky could hurt and break a rib of ali during the fight... but ali is the clear winner by decision or even late tko. marciano would havea much better chance vs 70s static ali

 

McV, it's not necessarily being "gracious" in my opinion. Ali was much less than gracious toward many a fighter during his career, but you know that.

Ali seemed to be far more "gracious" regarding a possible fight against Marciano than he was toward many others.

Maybe, McV, Ali was giving a genuinely honest answer to the question?

I reckon Ali was aware that Marciano would have given him a far tougher contest than some contributors to this thread are willing to acknowledge.

 

Ali would have had trouble with Walcott and Charles as well remember he was dropped by Cooper and had trouble with Doug Jones who were not heavy guys. Also Ringo B. gave him a rough time and I don't think anyone thinks Ringo hit harder than Marciano nor was as relentless and conditioned.

Marciano KO'd Keene Simmons as he did with Charles. I think this is a tough fight for both men and while Marciano's right hand showed one punch power over Louis,Walcott,Layne his hook showed power against Moore,Charles,Lastarza, Mathews and others, both hands were dangerous and add relentless stamina and heart and solid chin

And while we can only guess the outcome IMO this is very tough fight for both men

 

Ali was always gracious to past champions . That I do know.
Marciano , after their computer fight said," I've never seen anyone with hands that fast ."
Marciano gets his arse kicked by Ali, his face shredded like raw hamburger,and an embarrassing boxing lesson similar to the one that an ancient Walcott was handing out for 12 rounds.

 

:good Ali was honest and said he hurt my arms when he was an old man and I think Marciano was better than Frazier

He didn't say that about Dempsey or Louis ETC

 

ali would give charles and walcott a complete beating..

 

Ali withstood the body attack of Foreman because he no longer had the legs to "dance all night", Marciano has nothing to beat him with.Walcott said of Ali, "he beats all us old guys because we needed room to punch ". Ali stopped all the punchers he faced except for Mac Foster ,and he beat him like a drum. Relentless stamina? And Ali lacked it? Heart? And Ali lacked one? Solid Chin? And Ali didn't ?

Ali is light years better than Marciano whose best wins were over men aged, and well past prime. Ali was beating the young lions when he was past his best,and at an age when Marciano was safely retired protecting his unbeaten legacy.
Marciano kod Simmons? And Ali stopped both Cooper and Bonavena, flooring him three times something Frazier couldn't do in two tries.

 

Always? Have you read his foreword to Harry Carpenter's "Pictorial History of Boxing"? Less than gracious there McV.

Regarding the quote you produce from Marciano...maybe he was being gracious too? It cuts both ways. It appears you want to take Marcino's quote at face value, as an honest answer, but choose not to construe Ali's comments in the same way. Why is that?

 

A few things here:

Firstly what is it with this crazy thing about Marciano being stopped on cuts in every fight ever??? Marciano suffered a super feckin super freak injury to his nose which is the most bizarre and freaky injury I've seen in a heavyweight title fight - so much so that I named myself after it - but you know? Bizarre injuries have happened and will happen?? You can't just turn around and say oh this will happen in any and every fight?? Feckin heck Hasim Rahman had a feckin giant brick hanging off the side of his head against Holyfield!?? What we gunna do? Say that in every conceivable fantasy match up he loses by freaky weird brick head stoppage everytime?? This is ridiculous??

Other than the nose what even bad cut did Marciano get? The cut against Charles the first fight (which was just basically the cut he got against Simmons re opening?? That's it?? Effectively one cut?? People who say the same thing that happened against Cooper need their head tested - Cooper didn't just cut in literally every fight - his feckin face opened up - his weren't normal cuts - Ali didn't produce anything unusual against Cooper? every fighter did that to cooper - and not just little cuts every fight there'd be blood everywhere and his cuts were long and gaping every fight? Marciano didn't have anything remotely similar to this??

Plus the speed difference is over stated here too in a big way - Marciano was pretty quick as it happened - he was 185lbs for christs sake he ain't going to be slow like Foreman and Liston etc?? And he didn't have 28inch thigh to chug around like Frazier so he ain't going to be chugging along like him either - Christ he had no discernible problem whatsoever keeping up with Ali in the Computer fight in '69 - if the gulf in speed was as big as some people think then it would for damn sure have shown in that - I don't care if Ali was out of shape - he was a 27 year old and Marciano was 45 and had no problems whatsoever keeping up with Ali? Put a 29 year old Matciano in there with Ali he has no problem with the speed at all - there are ways of stopping a guy moving constantly at crazy speeds continually anyway and Rock certainly knew how to stop that

 

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He never sparred with either of them did he?

 

I agree with you here, but when is the last time that you predicted that a real world fight was going to end in a stoppage due to cuts?

Even if this is quite a plausible outcome, it is hard to justify picking it as the most likely case scenario.

 

RSN, I completely agree with your first 2 paragraphs.

But the last one is completely wrong.

1) Thigh size has no necessary correlation with speed. Ali had 25" thighs, bigger than most past champions, & was faster than all of them.
Tyson had 27: myscular thighs & was very quick. A ton of top athletes in say basketball & football are very-extremely quick, especially over short distances, with big thighs. Look up the measurements of most all top sprinters like Usain Bolt. They have known for decades now that having more muscle than the old stringy springters build tends to INCREASE speed.

2) Frazier did not have more than 26" thighs, check any tale of the tape. Credibility & God are in the proverbial details

3) I am surprised that you use the computer fight as any indication of the speed of even an out of shape exiled Ali. It was completely choreographed! This could not be done if Ali was jabbing Rocky silly or running rings around him. You think Ali actually stepped on the gas with Marciano, especially re: foot speed? no way.

4) I have never seen anyone argue that Marciano was "pretty quick". I see no video that shows this either. Rocky had many virtures & I like him & he made the most of his gifts, great heart & endurance, 2 handed punching power, chin, some subtle skills...

But when you say he was pretty fast & do not see a massive speed difference with Ali & even think the completely orchestarted super-fights show anything re: speed...

You are heavily biased in these regards.

 

Marciano was cut in 4 of his 7 defenses he was also cut against Louis and Simmons just deal with it and stop trying to make out it didnt happen. Marciano was SLOW ,SLOW OF FOOT AND SLOW OF HAND,Prime Liston had quicker hands watch the fights.
Henry Cooper was cut in 4 fights that is two less than Marciano.

If you are going to judge how a 46years old toupeed Marciano did against a fat Ali in a punches pulled act and use it to form an opinion then I'm not wasting any more time answering your post.:hi:

 

Ali could be hit by left hooks, and hurt by them. He was also open at times for body shots, and had some issues with smaller fighters like Patterson. Sounds like Rocky, who was good at all of the above in addition to being smaller has a chance.

But Ali's got too much speed, size, and weight here. In addition, Ali could fight going backward. Rocky would have a tough time getting into range.

I see it 10-5 in favor of Ali, but I do think Rocky could win a round or two by a large margin.

Ali once sparred with Marciano for their computer fight. Rocky was old and heavy, but Ali did come out of it with a lot of respect for the former champion. There was a moment when Ali messed with Marciano's toupee during the action, and Rocky landed a mean body shot that lead to Ali taking a break.