How does Andre Ward stack up against past greats H2H?

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by Southpaws, Aug 30, 2014.


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  1. Southpaws

    Southpaws Guest

    this has always interested me because ward is a complete fighter, he can box, he has good defense, he has a solid inside game, he has power, speed, footwork, a decent chin, everything a boxer needs. how does he stack up against past greats h2h? i think he can beat most of them IMO
     
    Southpaws, Aug 30, 2014
    Southpaws, Aug 30, 2014
    #1
  2. robert ungurean

    robert ungurean Богдан Philadelphia Full Member

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    His resume is too thin to ask this question in my book.
     
    robert ungurean, Aug 30, 2014
    robert ungurean, Aug 30, 2014
    #2
  3. Southpaws

    Southpaws Guest

    i thought skills payed the bills
     
    Southpaws, Aug 30, 2014
    Southpaws, Aug 30, 2014
    #3
  4. burt bienstock

    burt bienstock Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    How can you rate a man that fights once or twice a year against hand picked opponents,
    against a Jack Britton,who had about 350 bouts without ever being stopped, nor a
    Willie Pep who was a wizard with over 200 bouts, or the seldom mentioned Billy Graham
    who in over 120 fights was never floored ? Andre Ward has not begun to prove himself to
    rate anywhere in the discussion of past greats who fought 20 times a year at times,
    against whoever the public wanted to see, and sucked it up while hurt to truly rate in past great categories...
     
    burt bienstock, Aug 30, 2014
    burt bienstock, Aug 30, 2014
    #4
  5. Southpaws

    Southpaws Guest

    this is a head to head discussion. if u think that there's a direct correlation between skills and how many times a person fought then boxing isn't the sport for u. it's like saying that sam langford can beat ali just because he fought more hall of famers and fought more often or that sam langford can beat tyson for the same reason. personally i think tyson beats the hell out of langford. :patsch
     
    Southpaws, Aug 30, 2014
    Southpaws, Aug 30, 2014
    #5
  6. robert ungurean

    robert ungurean Богдан Philadelphia Full Member

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    Well how can u rate his skill if he hasn't fought great fighters?
     
    robert ungurean, Aug 30, 2014
    robert ungurean, Aug 30, 2014
    #6
  7. Southpaws

    Southpaws Guest

    ward has fought plenty of great fighters, they're not great on a pound for pound basis but they are very good fighters.
     
    Southpaws, Aug 30, 2014
    Southpaws, Aug 30, 2014
    #7
  8. ForemanJab

    ForemanJab Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I think a lot of guys past and present beat him at 168 and 175
     
    ForemanJab, Aug 30, 2014
    ForemanJab, Aug 30, 2014
    #8
  9. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    It's very difficult to say, on balance, what he would be able to do against an absolutely world class swarm attack, world class jab, against a trapsmith, against a truly elegant boxer, because he hasn't fought anyone.

    You basically try to build a case for how good he is based on Froch and Kessler. Not easy.
     
    McGrain, Aug 30, 2014
    McGrain, Aug 30, 2014
    #9
  10. robert ungurean

    robert ungurean Богдан Philadelphia Full Member

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    Well said.:good
     
    robert ungurean, Aug 30, 2014
    robert ungurean, Aug 30, 2014
    #10
  11. Southpaws

    Southpaws Guest

    i don't try to build a case on resumes alone because of the ali and langford example i used. 178-32-40 that's 200 plus fights and over 50 victories over hall of famers(i believe)vs 56-5 over 20 hall of fame victories. so who has the better resume? langford. but who's ranked higher both h2h and p4p? ali. i feel as though people only bring up resume when it comes to modern fighters. :verysad
     
    Southpaws, Aug 30, 2014
    Southpaws, Aug 30, 2014
    #11
  12. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Langford ranks higher than Ali p4p by my reckoning.

    http://www.boxing.com/the_100_greatest_fighters_of_all_time_part_ten_10_1.html

    Regardless, Ali is absolutely proven as likely the greatest fighter in his divisions history. These things reach a certain point and its reasonable to say whatever.

    Ward isn't at that point. Nowhere near that point.

    But you can, if you want, do a detailed breakdown of his skillset and try to apply it to what would happen with this one or that one. The problem is, there is a point where even the laws of physics break down under close examination.

    Same here. A good example is Mijares. A certain type of poster tried to insist certain things about Mijares on this forum up until Vic kicked his ****ing head in. Then they all vanished.

    No way to test steel except against steel. And that's a fact.
     
    McGrain, Aug 30, 2014
    McGrain, Aug 30, 2014
    #12
  13. red cobra

    red cobra Loyal Member Full Member

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    The thread question brings to mind just how shallow this modern day scene is. Ward may be talented, but he seems to be the latest ad for "quick and easy...just add water and stir...instant alltime great mix!!!" Hell, he hasn't proven himself...or done anything remotely worth a damn....the least he could do would be to corner Bernard Hopkins and shame him into a bout...Ward would easily win, and perhaps even get it done more impressively than the man he himself whipped,..Chad Dawson. Putting the final kibosh on Hopkins would at least convince most fans that Ward is still alive and not in the witness protection program. The answer to the thread question is..."he DOESN'T stack up at all against the greats of the past....yet."
     
    red cobra, Aug 30, 2014
    red cobra, Aug 30, 2014
    #13
  14. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Nobody is saying Ward is an ATG.

    Hopkins has said he will never fight Ward.

    Ward has injury and legal problems, and that's his biggest bar to achievement currently.
     
    McGrain, Aug 30, 2014
    McGrain, Aug 30, 2014
    #14
  15. red cobra

    red cobra Loyal Member Full Member

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    Well then, the final sentence in my previous post says it all quite succinctly.
     
    red cobra, Aug 30, 2014
    red cobra, Aug 30, 2014
    #15
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